1
00:00:21,720 --> 00:00:09,089
welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

2
00:00:29,820 --> 00:00:24,430
hello and welcome to the skeptic zone

3
00:00:32,830 --> 00:00:29,830
episode number 242 for the eighth of jun

4
00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:32,840
2013 Richard Saunders here with you from

5
00:00:36,850 --> 00:00:35,210
Sydney Australia coming up on this

6
00:00:39,250 --> 00:00:36,860
week's show we're going to kick off with

7
00:00:42,070 --> 00:00:39,260
an interview with a very dear friend of

8
00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:42,080
mine DJ Grothe the president of the

9
00:00:48,930 --> 00:00:45,650
James Randi Educational Foundation DJ's

10
00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:48,940
here to tell us more about the upcoming

11
00:00:57,100 --> 00:00:54,050
amazing meeting tam-tam 2013 in Las

12
00:00:58,840 --> 00:00:57,110
Vegas certainly a highlight a highlight

13
00:01:00,850 --> 00:00:58,850
of the skeptical calendar and a

14
00:01:02,380 --> 00:01:00,860
highlight of my year I always look

15
00:01:04,299 --> 00:01:02,390
forward to the amazing meeting I get the

16
00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:04,309
chance to meet many many skeptics own

17
00:01:10,720 --> 00:01:06,010
listeners which is always a treat and

18
00:01:11,950 --> 00:01:10,730
also well we'll find out more with the

19
00:01:14,320 --> 00:01:11,960
interview coming up at the top of the

20
00:01:17,260 --> 00:01:14,330
show with DJ Grothe and following that

21
00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:17,270
it's dr. Richie reports now a couple of

22
00:01:23,020 --> 00:01:20,210
weeks ago dr. Richie was on ABC radio

23
00:01:26,230 --> 00:01:23,030
and we thank the ABC very much for the

24
00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:26,240
audio dr. H he was interviewed and took

25
00:01:33,249 --> 00:01:30,770
some more call in questions that's dr. H

26
00:01:35,740 --> 00:01:33,259
E on the radio coming up a bit later in

27
00:01:37,660 --> 00:01:35,750
the show and then it's a week in science

28
00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:37,670
from the Royal Institution of Australia

29
00:01:45,819 --> 00:01:43,490
www RI aus org dot a you with the

30
00:01:49,359 --> 00:01:45,829
delightful Tonya Meyer because Paul

31
00:01:52,719 --> 00:01:49,369
Willis poor Willis it was out of town in

32
00:01:55,300 --> 00:01:52,729
fact he was in this town so after a week

33
00:01:57,670 --> 00:01:55,310
in science its Maynard spooky action

34
00:01:59,859 --> 00:01:57,680
Maynard the pub the other night here in

35
00:02:02,289 --> 00:01:59,869
Sydney where he interviews none other

36
00:02:04,740 --> 00:02:02,299
than dr. Paul Willis and dr. Paul Willis

37
00:02:06,969 --> 00:02:04,750
will tell us more about his interesting

38
00:02:10,810 --> 00:02:06,979
encounters with the creationists and

39
00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:10,820
some breaking news from China regarding

40
00:02:16,090 --> 00:02:13,370
dinosaurs and after that main our chats

41
00:02:19,270 --> 00:02:16,100
to various pub goers and ask the big

42
00:02:21,670 --> 00:02:19,280
question when should skeptics stop

43
00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:21,680
investigating something hmm that's

44
00:02:25,630 --> 00:02:23,690
coming up to round off the show don't

45
00:02:29,830 --> 00:02:25,640
forget you can follow the skeptic zone

46
00:02:32,770 --> 00:02:29,840
on twitter at skeptic zone very easy to

47
00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:32,780
remember but now it's time for me to run

48
00:02:40,809 --> 00:02:34,690
downstairs

49
00:02:45,309 --> 00:02:40,819
mmm sourdough bread posted then some

50
00:02:49,570 --> 00:02:45,319
smoked salmon on top of that spreading

51
00:02:54,059 --> 00:02:49,580
avocado on top of that and rounding that

52
00:02:58,140 --> 00:02:54,069
off with some quince jam or quince jelly

53
00:03:00,789 --> 00:02:58,150
whoa right yes I think I were to do that

54
00:03:21,780 --> 00:03:00,799
while I'm doing that I hope you enjoy

55
00:03:28,150 --> 00:03:25,330
and joining me on the line now it's none

56
00:03:29,770 --> 00:03:28,160
other than DJ Grothe hello DJ well hello

57
00:03:32,500 --> 00:03:29,780
Richard good to be on the show again

58
00:03:35,710 --> 00:03:32,510
chat with you how have you been I I take

59
00:03:38,350 --> 00:03:35,720
it you keep yourself busy as all but

60
00:03:41,230 --> 00:03:38,360
insanely busy skeptics do and you're one

61
00:03:44,500 --> 00:03:41,240
of the busiest I tried DJ I try as you

62
00:03:47,470 --> 00:03:44,510
know I really love outreach and that's

63
00:03:50,590 --> 00:03:47,480
what I love to talk to people and

64
00:03:53,260 --> 00:03:50,600
demonstrate things and hopefully

65
00:03:55,630 --> 00:03:53,270
hopefully sway people to our way of

66
00:03:57,580 --> 00:03:55,640
thinking which is a good segue we might

67
00:03:59,560 --> 00:03:57,590
say because that's exactly what I'll be

68
00:04:02,860 --> 00:03:59,570
doing and many other people including

69
00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:02,870
yourself at the upcoming amazing meeting

70
00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:06,410
tam Las Vegas coming around again right

71
00:04:10,900 --> 00:04:07,850
we're very excited about this upcoming

72
00:04:12,340 --> 00:04:10,910
event it's in july july eleventh for

73
00:04:14,740 --> 00:04:12,350
fourteenth and we think this is the

74
00:04:16,210 --> 00:04:14,750
biggest best amazing meeting we've ever

75
00:04:17,740 --> 00:04:16,220
put on you know that we've done them

76
00:04:21,070 --> 00:04:17,750
around the world we've done a couple in

77
00:04:24,370 --> 00:04:21,080
the UK we did tam australia we've

78
00:04:26,469 --> 00:04:24,380
supported the australian skeptics

79
00:04:28,810 --> 00:04:26,479
conference and eventually all around the

80
00:04:31,810 --> 00:04:28,820
world but the big kahuna for us is the

81
00:04:34,510 --> 00:04:31,820
amazing meeting in vegas and its really

82
00:04:36,490 --> 00:04:34,520
the largest event of its kind in the

83
00:04:39,190 --> 00:04:36,500
world we have well over a thousand folks

84
00:04:44,050 --> 00:04:39,200
come for four full days of programming

85
00:04:47,740 --> 00:04:44,060
in vegas in july so there are workshops

86
00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:47,750
and panel discussions over 75 different

87
00:04:54,030 --> 00:04:50,210
presenters their evening shows late

88
00:04:57,190 --> 00:04:54,040
night late night events there are

89
00:04:59,080 --> 00:04:57,200
parties and there's a live

90
00:05:01,270 --> 00:04:59,090
million-dollar challenge there's in

91
00:05:04,090 --> 00:05:01,280
other words there's just a lot going on

92
00:05:07,570 --> 00:05:04,100
we sort of think of it as a four-day

93
00:05:09,550 --> 00:05:07,580
vacation from unreason and folks show up

94
00:05:11,200 --> 00:05:09,560
and get involved in all the ways that i

95
00:05:12,820 --> 00:05:11,210
just mentioned you'll be there again

96
00:05:15,370 --> 00:05:12,830
this year you're on the program you're

97
00:05:17,469 --> 00:05:15,380
contributing to the great conversation

98
00:05:19,330 --> 00:05:17,479
of skepticism we have going on and we

99
00:05:23,110 --> 00:05:19,340
have just really some of the leading

100
00:05:25,900 --> 00:05:23,120
lights of the day plugged in and as

101
00:05:28,270 --> 00:05:25,910
part of the event this year were again

102
00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:28,280
really excited people often ask me why I

103
00:05:33,129 --> 00:05:31,250
keep going to these events I tried to go

104
00:05:35,439 --> 00:05:33,139
to them around the world if when I'm

105
00:05:36,879 --> 00:05:35,449
lucky enough to be able to do it and one

106
00:05:38,500 --> 00:05:36,889
of the I guess there are several reasons

107
00:05:40,510 --> 00:05:38,510
but if certainly one of the major

108
00:05:44,740 --> 00:05:40,520
reasons I go is to sit in the audience

109
00:05:45,939 --> 00:05:44,750
and learn from the wonderful speakers

110
00:05:48,189 --> 00:05:45,949
that come along to conventions

111
00:05:50,379 --> 00:05:48,199
especially like the ones at tam because

112
00:05:52,570 --> 00:05:50,389
as you know skepticism and what we do is

113
00:05:54,820 --> 00:05:52,580
an ongoing learning process and what

114
00:05:58,090 --> 00:05:54,830
better way than to hear from these

115
00:06:00,340 --> 00:05:58,100
people themselves exactly so that is a

116
00:06:02,110 --> 00:06:00,350
big component of Tam it's sort of like I

117
00:06:06,430 --> 00:06:02,120
think your listeners will be familiar

118
00:06:08,830 --> 00:06:06,440
with ted talks right Ted well this is in

119
00:06:10,689 --> 00:06:08,840
a sense sort of a Ted of skepticism we

120
00:06:12,550 --> 00:06:10,699
have a lot of presenters giving you know

121
00:06:15,760 --> 00:06:12,560
their half an hour talks on that their

122
00:06:17,590 --> 00:06:15,770
areas of expertise this year we have the

123
00:06:20,260 --> 00:06:17,600
really leading figure in the history

124
00:06:21,939 --> 00:06:20,270
skepticism Susan Blackmore is speaking

125
00:06:24,430 --> 00:06:21,949
the evolutionary biologist and

126
00:06:27,279 --> 00:06:24,440
best-selling author Jerry Coyne the

127
00:06:29,290 --> 00:06:27,289
great this some people sort of call him

128
00:06:31,930 --> 00:06:29,300
the James Randi of India so now at a

129
00:06:35,170 --> 00:06:31,940
Morocco is speaking Susan Hawk the

130
00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:35,180
philosopher the sexologist and skeptic

131
00:06:41,110 --> 00:06:38,770
mar decline michael e man the

132
00:06:43,750 --> 00:06:41,120
climatologist and the climate scientists

133
00:06:46,719 --> 00:06:43,760
who does a lot of work about denialism

134
00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:46,729
of global warming and and skepticism of

135
00:06:52,629 --> 00:06:48,650
the pseudoscience involved around that

136
00:06:54,580 --> 00:06:52,639
denialism and then a lot of our old

137
00:06:57,010 --> 00:06:54,590
favorites right so Penn Jillette and

138
00:07:00,580 --> 00:06:57,020
Michael Shermer and Jamie and Swiss

139
00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:00,590
Steve novella a lot of people are part

140
00:07:05,830 --> 00:07:03,410
of the program so what you just

141
00:07:08,890 --> 00:07:05,840
mentioned is significant it's this

142
00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:08,900
learning opportunity but at the amazing

143
00:07:13,750 --> 00:07:10,250
meeting it's more than that it's

144
00:07:16,629 --> 00:07:13,760
participatory we have 10 workshops at

145
00:07:18,550 --> 00:07:16,639
the amazing meeting this year these are

146
00:07:20,170 --> 00:07:18,560
hands-on opportunities for people to

147
00:07:22,450 --> 00:07:20,180
really roll up their sleeves and learn

148
00:07:25,900 --> 00:07:22,460
how to take can I put it this way take

149
00:07:29,020 --> 00:07:25,910
their this skepticism back to their own

150
00:07:30,310 --> 00:07:29,030
neck of the woods and as I say roll up

151
00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:30,320
their sleeves get their hands dirty

152
00:07:36,180 --> 00:07:33,250
advancing skepticism at the local level

153
00:07:38,220 --> 00:07:36,190
we have the panel disc

154
00:07:39,690 --> 00:07:38,230
missions and sort of debates and we

155
00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:39,700
don't really frame them as debates it's

156
00:07:44,130 --> 00:07:41,050
not going to be knocked down drag out

157
00:07:45,780 --> 00:07:44,140
but in other words there's a diversity

158
00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:45,790
of viewpoints presented and people

159
00:07:50,880 --> 00:07:48,730
really get to engage on these issues so

160
00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:50,890
there's really a lot going on and as you

161
00:07:56,600 --> 00:07:52,810
know from last year in previous tams

162
00:08:01,110 --> 00:07:56,610
what we also really like to do is engage

163
00:08:03,690 --> 00:08:01,120
i'll use the term cultural competitors

164
00:08:05,610 --> 00:08:03,700
so last year at the amazing meeting we

165
00:08:08,550 --> 00:08:05,620
actually tested a paranormal claim

166
00:08:10,950 --> 00:08:08,560
claimant live on stage it's one of the

167
00:08:13,110 --> 00:08:10,960
most popular videos from last year's

168
00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:13,120
amazing meeting you could share a link

169
00:08:19,410 --> 00:08:16,090
with your listeners where we went

170
00:08:21,540 --> 00:08:19,420
through an exhaustive and very odd from

171
00:08:22,950 --> 00:08:21,550
my vantage sort of tedious but we cared

172
00:08:26,220 --> 00:08:22,960
about the issue enough we went through

173
00:08:29,460 --> 00:08:26,230
that process to test the claim of a sort

174
00:08:31,710 --> 00:08:29,470
of power balance band it was a went by

175
00:08:35,100 --> 00:08:31,720
another name but you were involved in

176
00:08:37,980 --> 00:08:35,110
that process and the claimant I was

177
00:08:39,630 --> 00:08:37,990
proud to say the claimant was happy with

178
00:08:41,610 --> 00:08:39,640
our approach so we weren't the post

179
00:08:43,409 --> 00:08:41,620
naysaying debunkers who reject claims

180
00:08:46,140 --> 00:08:43,419
out of hand we take the stuff seriously

181
00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:46,150
and even when we're dealing with folks

182
00:08:50,460 --> 00:08:48,010
who believe things for which we think

183
00:08:53,700 --> 00:08:50,470
there's inadequate evidence we do it

184
00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:53,710
respectfully we engage with them with

185
00:08:58,320 --> 00:08:56,170
civility because these questions are

186
00:09:01,770 --> 00:08:58,330
important and were not those sorts of

187
00:09:04,620 --> 00:09:01,780
naysayers who misunderstand skepticism

188
00:09:07,140 --> 00:09:04,630
to be just saying no to others beliefs

189
00:09:08,820 --> 00:09:07,150
instead skepticism at the amazing

190
00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:08,830
meeting and skepticism for the James

191
00:09:13,470 --> 00:09:10,930
Randi Educational Foundation is an

192
00:09:15,630 --> 00:09:13,480
open-minded inquiry that looks into

193
00:09:18,420 --> 00:09:15,640
these important claims really with an

194
00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:18,430
aim to help people guard themselves from

195
00:09:22,829 --> 00:09:21,490
nonsense or harmful beliefs especially

196
00:09:26,579 --> 00:09:22,839
the paranormal or super scientific

197
00:09:28,500 --> 00:09:26,589
variety yes these live challenges a huge

198
00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:28,510
highlight of the amazing meeting because

199
00:09:34,230 --> 00:09:31,810
people often hear about skeptics like

200
00:09:36,990 --> 00:09:34,240
you and myself and other organizations

201
00:09:38,670 --> 00:09:37,000
around the world testing or challenging

202
00:09:41,190 --> 00:09:38,680
these people with vast sums of money

203
00:09:45,329 --> 00:09:41,200
involved but to actually see one in

204
00:09:47,850 --> 00:09:45,339
progress it's it's quite a spellbinding

205
00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:47,860
even though I i agree last year's one

206
00:09:51,690 --> 00:09:50,050
was a lengthy and meticulous but that's

207
00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:51,700
certainly necessary in part of the

208
00:09:58,259 --> 00:09:55,930
process right and your listeners can see

209
00:10:01,199 --> 00:09:58,269
what tams all about including that video

210
00:10:04,620 --> 00:10:01,209
and see how popular was it sort of went

211
00:10:06,090 --> 00:10:04,630
viral online on our popular video

212
00:10:07,889 --> 00:10:06,100
channel one of the most subscribed

213
00:10:10,949 --> 00:10:07,899
nonprofit channels in youtube history

214
00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:10,959
we're told by YouTube it's found at

215
00:10:17,579 --> 00:10:15,010
youtube.com slash James Randi foundation

216
00:10:20,519 --> 00:10:17,589
and you'll see that live challenge there

217
00:10:22,500 --> 00:10:20,529
you could also see examples of other

218
00:10:25,949 --> 00:10:22,510
challenges and other presentations we've

219
00:10:28,350 --> 00:10:25,959
made talks on these various issues so

220
00:10:31,079 --> 00:10:28,360
there's a lot there's a lot going on and

221
00:10:32,850 --> 00:10:31,089
as I say it's the largest event of its

222
00:10:35,069 --> 00:10:32,860
kind in the world on scientific

223
00:10:36,810 --> 00:10:35,079
skepticism other other big conferences

224
00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:36,820
you go to tech conferences you're gonna

225
00:10:40,560 --> 00:10:38,410
I don't know if you're an atheist you

226
00:10:43,259 --> 00:10:40,570
good atheist conferences you go to all

227
00:10:45,480 --> 00:10:43,269
sorts of other kinds of events but this

228
00:10:48,660 --> 00:10:45,490
is the conference for scientific

229
00:10:50,280 --> 00:10:48,670
skepticism advancing the mission of the

230
00:10:52,560 --> 00:10:50,290
James Randi Educational Foundation the

231
00:10:55,190 --> 00:10:52,570
stuff that sort of cocoa here's this

232
00:10:57,780 --> 00:10:55,200
growing worldwide skeptics movement and

233
00:11:00,210 --> 00:10:57,790
we couldn't be happier with the response

234
00:11:02,730 --> 00:11:00,220
and the enthusiasm surrounding this

235
00:11:04,710 --> 00:11:02,740
year's event well I was just having a

236
00:11:09,380 --> 00:11:04,720
quick look at the website itself which

237
00:11:11,790 --> 00:11:09,390
is of course wwm aging meeting calm and

238
00:11:13,590 --> 00:11:11,800
just the workshops which you are

239
00:11:16,910 --> 00:11:13,600
mentioning a little earlier alone looked

240
00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:16,920
like more than enough reason to go along

241
00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:21,490
10 workshops how your camera lies to you

242
00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:24,450
blogging about skeptical blogging

243
00:11:29,130 --> 00:11:26,370
skepticism across the curriculum

244
00:11:31,710 --> 00:11:29,140
crowdsourcing skepticism metaphysics and

245
00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:31,720
fraud it goes on and on and on I think

246
00:11:35,550 --> 00:11:33,610
it's an every year I noticed that these

247
00:11:37,310 --> 00:11:35,560
workshops are growing more important and

248
00:11:41,310 --> 00:11:37,320
you're certainly getting more of them

249
00:11:43,530 --> 00:11:41,320
right we think while the component of

250
00:11:47,790 --> 00:11:43,540
you know sitting with a thousand or so

251
00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:47,800
of your intellectual peers and listening

252
00:11:52,500 --> 00:11:49,810
to the leading lights of the day on

253
00:11:55,740 --> 00:11:52,510
stage we think that's important yes but

254
00:11:58,410 --> 00:11:55,750
we also think it's so vital for people

255
00:12:01,230 --> 00:11:58,420
to participate in the conversation these

256
00:12:02,660 --> 00:12:01,240
workshops are hands-on ways of sort of

257
00:12:05,660 --> 00:12:02,670
getting trained to

258
00:12:07,910 --> 00:12:05,670
work with us to advance this important

259
00:12:11,990 --> 00:12:07,920
point of view the skepticism a method of

260
00:12:14,750 --> 00:12:12,000
inquiry at the local level and so that's

261
00:12:17,540 --> 00:12:14,760
really what these workshops have

262
00:12:21,770 --> 00:12:17,550
developed into you know years ago we do

263
00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:21,780
one or two and then they sort of grew a

264
00:12:28,550 --> 00:12:25,490
number and now it's we offer 10

265
00:12:31,010 --> 00:12:28,560
full-blown workshops and attendees can

266
00:12:33,830 --> 00:12:31,020
get a thing called the all workshop pass

267
00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:33,840
which entitles that into all ten

268
00:12:38,060 --> 00:12:36,210
workshops there concurrent so you you

269
00:12:39,620 --> 00:12:38,070
know it's unlikely you'd be able to go

270
00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:39,630
to all of them but the point is you have

271
00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:42,930
the choice of whether it's the how

272
00:12:47,420 --> 00:12:45,450
rational are you work shop or a workshop

273
00:12:49,430 --> 00:12:47,430
on how to get involved in preserving

274
00:12:51,560 --> 00:12:49,440
skeptic history there's the really

275
00:12:53,660 --> 00:12:51,570
popular science based medicine work shop

276
00:12:59,210 --> 00:12:53,670
run by Steve novella and his team of

277
00:13:01,340 --> 00:12:59,220
science and skepticism at all doctors or

278
00:13:03,830 --> 00:13:01,350
science base but you'll learn a defense

279
00:13:06,380 --> 00:13:03,840
like the amazing meeting not so I'm

280
00:13:09,350 --> 00:13:06,390
scientists Bush alternative

281
00:13:10,970 --> 00:13:09,360
complementary and alternative modalities

282
00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:10,980
and so there's a lot going on in that

283
00:13:16,070 --> 00:13:13,290
way one of the things that I get a kick

284
00:13:17,450 --> 00:13:16,080
out at tam and you know it's it's weird

285
00:13:19,490 --> 00:13:17,460
to emphasize one thing or another

286
00:13:21,950 --> 00:13:19,500
because there's so much going on this is

287
00:13:24,410 --> 00:13:21,960
the biggest event of its kind a lot of

288
00:13:27,110 --> 00:13:24,420
moving parts events going on from what

289
00:13:28,970 --> 00:13:27,120
8am till after midnight every day for

290
00:13:33,050 --> 00:13:28,980
four days in a row but something I

291
00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:33,060
really enjoy this shows the amazing

292
00:13:37,070 --> 00:13:34,410
meeting unlike really any other

293
00:13:40,370 --> 00:13:37,080
conference out there we do really high

294
00:13:42,550 --> 00:13:40,380
quality high production value events in

295
00:13:46,580 --> 00:13:42,560
the evenings these are ticketed items of

296
00:13:51,050 --> 00:13:46,590
performances so this year we're doing

297
00:13:54,340 --> 00:13:51,060
like a magic and mentalism show and also

298
00:13:57,320 --> 00:13:54,350
some sideshow stunts and and

299
00:14:00,530 --> 00:13:57,330
performances featuring that's john

300
00:14:02,750 --> 00:14:00,540
armstrong and the Krystyn Lambert and

301
00:14:05,750 --> 00:14:02,760
some mentalism with Johnny savant and

302
00:14:07,730 --> 00:14:05,760
Carolyn Gayle Jamy Ian Swiss would be

303
00:14:11,380 --> 00:14:07,740
known to your listeners he's on the

304
00:14:14,630 --> 00:14:11,390
program performing Todd Robbins the

305
00:14:16,370 --> 00:14:14,640
fantastic performer really jack of all

306
00:14:20,810 --> 00:14:16,380
trades sideshow performer but

307
00:14:23,690 --> 00:14:20,820
so does spooky presentations and was

308
00:14:25,190 --> 00:14:23,700
involved in tellers off-broadway show

309
00:14:28,190 --> 00:14:25,200
while both of them came together to do

310
00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:28,200
that play dead event he's coming back to

311
00:14:33,740 --> 00:14:31,650
town other evening events include this

312
00:14:35,990 --> 00:14:33,750
great concert that Penn Jillette has

313
00:14:39,050 --> 00:14:36,000
been doing for us for the past few years

314
00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:39,060
his private rock and roll donut and

315
00:14:43,730 --> 00:14:41,250
bacon party oh that's a bad night that's

316
00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:43,740
always a big knobby knees right I you

317
00:14:48,260 --> 00:14:45,690
know for some folks I have to say that's

318
00:14:51,020 --> 00:14:48,270
in a sense the heart of Tam for some

319
00:14:53,450 --> 00:14:51,030
folks because that is the you know he he

320
00:14:55,760 --> 00:14:53,460
and his band are up there really singing

321
00:14:59,330 --> 00:14:55,770
love songs to Randy and for skepticism

322
00:15:02,570 --> 00:14:59,340
at this point of view and it's at the

323
00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:02,580
fellow feeling at that event you know

324
00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:04,890
it's one big happy family and it's just

325
00:15:11,750 --> 00:15:07,650
a beautiful beautiful time not to

326
00:15:14,870 --> 00:15:11,760
mention you get donuts and bacon and you

327
00:15:17,210 --> 00:15:14,880
know it's a celebration so there's a lot

328
00:15:20,750 --> 00:15:17,220
going on and and we really hope we see

329
00:15:22,340 --> 00:15:20,760
some of your listeners at the event any

330
00:15:24,650 --> 00:15:22,350
of your listeners who are interested in

331
00:15:27,290 --> 00:15:24,660
registering for Tam if they haven't

332
00:15:28,970 --> 00:15:27,300
already if they do it in the next 24

333
00:15:33,230 --> 00:15:28,980
hours there's still time to get this

334
00:15:36,410 --> 00:15:33,240
great Jay ref code with the hotel which

335
00:15:39,020 --> 00:15:36,420
makes the hotel rooms unbelievably

336
00:15:41,990 --> 00:15:39,030
affordable in fact when you factor all

337
00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:42,000
that in the amazing meeting is actually

338
00:15:47,630 --> 00:15:44,370
get this cheaper than any other

339
00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:47,640
conference of its kind when you factor

340
00:15:53,420 --> 00:15:50,490
in how inexpensive the hotel is right so

341
00:15:55,670 --> 00:15:53,430
it's a full four day event meals come

342
00:15:57,770 --> 00:15:55,680
with registration you'd think that'd be

343
00:15:59,600 --> 00:15:57,780
a super expensive event but because of

344
00:16:01,400 --> 00:15:59,610
the relationship we have with the hotel

345
00:16:04,580 --> 00:16:01,410
you know some of the hotel nights what

346
00:16:07,370 --> 00:16:04,590
it they could be as inexpensive as forty

347
00:16:10,580 --> 00:16:07,380
five dollars a night not 200 bucks or

348
00:16:12,860 --> 00:16:10,590
more like some other conferences so that

349
00:16:15,470 --> 00:16:12,870
code is still good for the next 24 hours

350
00:16:19,250 --> 00:16:15,480
you can get that at amazing meeting calm

351
00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:19,260
in addition there are discounts and

352
00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:21,450
other opportunities for people to get

353
00:16:26,300 --> 00:16:23,130
involved that they could find by going

354
00:16:27,650 --> 00:16:26,310
to your website or going to amazing

355
00:16:29,689 --> 00:16:27,660
leading calm there are a lot of grant

356
00:16:31,849 --> 00:16:29,699
opportunities tons

357
00:16:33,590 --> 00:16:31,859
folks actually get to come to the

358
00:16:36,409 --> 00:16:33,600
amazing meeting for free because of

359
00:16:39,769 --> 00:16:36,419
scholarship and grant opportunities for

360
00:16:42,019 --> 00:16:39,779
students and for members of Jarrett's

361
00:16:46,789 --> 00:16:42,029
online community and and that sort of

362
00:16:48,769 --> 00:16:46,799
thing so why merrier it sounds

363
00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:48,779
exhausting it sounds exhausting just

364
00:16:52,519 --> 00:16:50,970
just hearing about it let alone going to

365
00:16:54,769 --> 00:16:52,529
it and it is a veteran of many times

366
00:16:57,530 --> 00:16:54,779
myself I always come away completely

367
00:16:59,960 --> 00:16:57,540
exhausted but it completely exhilarated

368
00:17:01,429 --> 00:16:59,970
and and all the new things I learned and

369
00:17:03,530 --> 00:17:01,439
one of the things it pleases me very

370
00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:03,540
very much where I'm at the amazing

371
00:17:08,360 --> 00:17:05,730
meeting is quite often the MC and this

372
00:17:09,620 --> 00:17:08,370
this year once again it's I'm very glad

373
00:17:12,439 --> 00:17:09,630
to see it's going to be a good friend

374
00:17:15,009 --> 00:17:12,449
George shrub he'll ask or you'll ask the

375
00:17:17,779 --> 00:17:15,019
audience how many in the audience of the

376
00:17:20,449 --> 00:17:17,789
thousand-plus people are first-timers or

377
00:17:23,360 --> 00:17:20,459
first-timers as we call them and so many

378
00:17:25,610 --> 00:17:23,370
hands go up it's a good thing to see

379
00:17:27,490 --> 00:17:25,620
that people every year come for the

380
00:17:31,129 --> 00:17:27,500
first time and have a really good time

381
00:17:34,669 --> 00:17:31,139
right George frap really is the man for

382
00:17:37,639 --> 00:17:34,679
the job I can't either he's so good at

383
00:17:39,889 --> 00:17:37,649
what he does and he just has the right

384
00:17:42,139 --> 00:17:39,899
touch the perfect mix of being serious

385
00:17:44,029 --> 00:17:42,149
minded and very entertaining and fun and

386
00:17:45,710 --> 00:17:44,039
funny and musical and all of that and

387
00:17:47,930 --> 00:17:45,720
he's a bona fide you know

388
00:17:51,889 --> 00:17:47,940
dyed-in-the-wool skeptic oh that's great

389
00:17:55,070 --> 00:17:51,899
and you're right about this component of

390
00:17:57,379 --> 00:17:55,080
Tam being can I say an outreach event so

391
00:18:00,379 --> 00:17:57,389
if you have a thousand or more people

392
00:18:04,490 --> 00:18:00,389
every year and thirty or forty percent

393
00:18:07,159 --> 00:18:04,500
year after year our new folks who even

394
00:18:09,590 --> 00:18:07,169
say this is my first skeptic event ever

395
00:18:12,830 --> 00:18:09,600
you see that these large events aren't

396
00:18:15,620 --> 00:18:12,840
just can I say preaching to the choir

397
00:18:18,740 --> 00:18:15,630
they're reaching new folks who get

398
00:18:21,169 --> 00:18:18,750
turned on and plugged in and in fact I

399
00:18:23,810 --> 00:18:21,179
know a lot of local organizations local

400
00:18:27,350 --> 00:18:23,820
skeptics organizations or campus groups

401
00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:27,360
or projects that have flowed out of ten

402
00:18:31,430 --> 00:18:29,610
people meet it the first time in vegas

403
00:18:33,919 --> 00:18:31,440
at the amazing meeting and they get

404
00:18:36,740 --> 00:18:33,929
inspired and energized as you say and

405
00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:36,750
then they go back to nantucket or Peoria

406
00:18:40,340 --> 00:18:38,610
or wherever they're from and they get

407
00:18:41,750 --> 00:18:40,350
involved at that local level they start

408
00:18:43,370 --> 00:18:41,760
a group or they get involved with a

409
00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:43,380
campaign that's

410
00:18:48,500 --> 00:18:46,170
it that's the payoff of an event like

411
00:18:50,060 --> 00:18:48,510
the amazing meeting so folks there's the

412
00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:50,070
word if you haven't been to town before

413
00:18:55,670 --> 00:18:52,970
you are in for a treat you get to

414
00:18:57,290 --> 00:18:55,680
socialize with wonderful people from all

415
00:18:59,180 --> 00:18:57,300
around the world many many different

416
00:19:01,370 --> 00:18:59,190
countries you can meet James Randi

417
00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:01,380
himself have a chat to him James Randi

418
00:19:05,660 --> 00:19:03,570
is always happy to meet people of the

419
00:19:07,310 --> 00:19:05,670
amazing meeting chat to other famous

420
00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:07,320
skeptics out there get some inside

421
00:19:14,660 --> 00:19:10,170
information or just sit back in the del

422
00:19:17,120 --> 00:19:14,670
mar bar and relax I cannot wait DJ I

423
00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:17,130
cannot wait for 10 coming up and i'll

424
00:19:23,150 --> 00:19:20,250
even give free pegasus origami folding

425
00:19:24,350 --> 00:19:23,160
lessons this year well I love the sound

426
00:19:27,230 --> 00:19:24,360
of that you're on the program in a

427
00:19:29,840 --> 00:19:27,240
couple places you've always contributed

428
00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:29,850
so mightily to our efforts and you're

429
00:19:33,140 --> 00:19:31,530
such a good friend of the James Randi

430
00:19:35,150 --> 00:19:33,150
Educational Foundation look forward to

431
00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:35,160
seeing you in just about five weeks my

432
00:19:40,190 --> 00:19:37,890
friend and and hopefully some of your

433
00:19:43,580 --> 00:19:40,200
listeners to thanks so much richer not a

434
00:19:46,070 --> 00:19:43,590
problem DJ folks WWE amazing meeting

435
00:20:00,450 --> 00:19:46,080
calm and we'll see you there DJ Grothe

436
00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:03,040
did you see that UFO sighting that made

437
00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:05,330
the news what did that latest study

438
00:20:09,430 --> 00:20:07,010
about alternative treatments really say

439
00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:09,440
is this photo making the rounds real or

440
00:20:14,260 --> 00:20:12,410
hoax duffle news is a unique website

441
00:20:16,420 --> 00:20:14,270
featuring news about pseudoscience the

442
00:20:18,120 --> 00:20:16,430
paranormal anomalies and questionable

443
00:20:21,070 --> 00:20:18,130
claims framed with the skeptical view

444
00:20:22,830 --> 00:20:21,080
come visit doubtful newscom every day

445
00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:22,840
for news about cryptozoology

446
00:20:29,470 --> 00:20:26,570
conspiracies shams scams and more follow

447
00:20:31,030 --> 00:20:29,480
us on twitter at doubtful news critical

448
00:20:33,310 --> 00:20:31,040
thinking is essential in assessing

449
00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:33,320
today's news duffel news helps you

450
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:45,010
now it's time for dr. Richie reports

451
00:20:52,090 --> 00:20:48,290
with dr. Rachel Dunlop

452
00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:52,100
on travel 6abc Canberra it's 2211 the

453
00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:54,170
world's richest man richest man most of

454
00:20:58,510 --> 00:20:56,330
the time is in town in the country if

455
00:20:59,830 --> 00:20:58,520
you're watching ABC TV last night you

456
00:21:02,560 --> 00:20:59,840
might have seen Bill Gates talking to

457
00:21:04,930 --> 00:21:02,570
lease sales and participating in a

458
00:21:06,940 --> 00:21:04,940
feisty Q&A that often focused on his

459
00:21:09,130 --> 00:21:06,950
change of direction from business

460
00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:09,140
towards philanthropy and a keystone in

461
00:21:13,900 --> 00:21:11,090
that process is his belief in the

462
00:21:15,790 --> 00:21:13,910
effectiveness of vaccination and it's

463
00:21:18,940 --> 00:21:15,800
urgent importance in developing nations

464
00:21:20,530 --> 00:21:18,950
in particular but also in the West here

465
00:21:22,330 --> 00:21:20,540
of course the debate about whether to

466
00:21:24,490 --> 00:21:22,340
exclude unvaccinated children from

467
00:21:26,410 --> 00:21:24,500
preschool attracted a lot of attention

468
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:26,420
in the past week the New South Wales

469
00:21:30,700 --> 00:21:28,250
Government has already begun passing

470
00:21:32,410 --> 00:21:30,710
those regulations and on the

471
00:21:35,170 --> 00:21:32,420
conversation website this week's

472
00:21:37,090 --> 00:21:35,180
most-read story is by my next guest dr.

473
00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:37,100
Rachel Dunlop is a postdoctoral fellow

474
00:21:41,290 --> 00:21:39,410
in the school of medical and molecular

475
00:21:43,630 --> 00:21:41,300
bio sciences at the University of

476
00:21:46,390 --> 00:21:43,640
Technology in Sydney she's also vice

477
00:21:48,460 --> 00:21:46,400
president of Australian skeptics and an

478
00:21:51,160 --> 00:21:48,470
avowed opponent of anti vaccination

479
00:21:53,530 --> 00:21:51,170
campaign as Rachel hello to you hello

480
00:21:54,790 --> 00:21:53,540
thanks for having me my pleasure now I

481
00:21:56,500 --> 00:21:54,800
mentioned you would have welcomed that

482
00:21:58,480 --> 00:21:56,510
call from Bill Gates about the important

483
00:22:00,250 --> 00:21:58,490
importance of vaccinations he was very

484
00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:00,260
clear about how significant he sees it

485
00:22:03,940 --> 00:22:02,450
as being wasn't he absolutely and I

486
00:22:05,980 --> 00:22:03,950
think he's absolutely on the money and

487
00:22:09,390 --> 00:22:05,990
he's spending a lot of his own money in

488
00:22:11,860 --> 00:22:09,400
fact dedicating himself to putting

489
00:22:15,310 --> 00:22:11,870
vaccines into third world countries and

490
00:22:16,690 --> 00:22:15,320
to getting people who are most at risk

491
00:22:18,820 --> 00:22:16,700
of getting preventable diseases

492
00:22:20,620 --> 00:22:18,830
vaccinated so they can be protected and

493
00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:20,630
I think he's committed ten billion

494
00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:22,490
dollars over the next 10 years which is

495
00:22:26,620 --> 00:22:24,170
a huge amount of money and it's such a

496
00:22:28,390 --> 00:22:26,630
great thing that he's doing so if the

497
00:22:30,070 --> 00:22:28,400
public health code is so widely accepted

498
00:22:32,410 --> 00:22:30,080
in developing nations by the UN by

499
00:22:34,030 --> 00:22:32,420
global aid initiatives why are we having

500
00:22:36,460 --> 00:22:34,040
an argument about this in this country

501
00:22:38,530 --> 00:22:36,470
Rachel I know isn't it silly well I

502
00:22:40,300 --> 00:22:38,540
guess it's kind of like people say it's

503
00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:40,310
a first world problem in a way isn't it

504
00:22:44,500 --> 00:22:42,290
because we don't tend to see these

505
00:22:46,120 --> 00:22:44,510
diseases much anymore in first world

506
00:22:48,460 --> 00:22:46,130
countries like Australia we don't see

507
00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:48,470
polio here anymore but of course it is

508
00:22:51,850 --> 00:22:49,730
happening in other parts of the world

509
00:22:53,740 --> 00:22:51,860
and so I guess people get a little bit

510
00:22:55,450 --> 00:22:53,750
complacent if you like if they don't see

511
00:22:57,730 --> 00:22:55,460
the disease's anymore I mean even a

512
00:23:00,100 --> 00:22:57,740
generation ago there were people that

513
00:23:02,050 --> 00:23:00,110
had polio many of us have grandparents

514
00:23:03,490 --> 00:23:02,060
at know people that had polio

515
00:23:05,350 --> 00:23:03,500
but we forget about these things that

516
00:23:07,780 --> 00:23:05,360
they're not in front of our faces and I

517
00:23:09,430 --> 00:23:07,790
suppose in a way vaccines are a victim

518
00:23:11,770 --> 00:23:09,440
of their own success in a way because

519
00:23:13,690 --> 00:23:11,780
they're so successful at eliminating

520
00:23:15,190 --> 00:23:13,700
preventable diseases that we don't see

521
00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:15,200
the disease's we forget how bad the

522
00:23:19,090 --> 00:23:17,570
diseases are and we elevate the risks

523
00:23:21,370 --> 00:23:19,100
from the vaccine instead of from the

524
00:23:22,570 --> 00:23:21,380
disease now is there a debate as such

525
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:22,580
because i have to say Rachel this

526
00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:24,650
reminds me a little of the whole climate

527
00:23:28,630 --> 00:23:26,810
change issue that we seem to have a

528
00:23:30,220 --> 00:23:28,640
debate which is out of proportion to the

529
00:23:32,620 --> 00:23:30,230
general scientific consensus on the

530
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:32,630
issue absolutely and in terms of the

531
00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:35,690
science there is no debate we know from

532
00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:38,090
years and years of Epidemiology from

533
00:23:43,500 --> 00:23:40,850
scientific research from clinical trials

534
00:23:45,670 --> 00:23:43,510
from lots of studies that vaccines are

535
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:45,680
overwhelmingly safe they're cheap and

536
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:47,450
they're effective so there's a very

537
00:23:52,810 --> 00:23:49,970
small number of people who oppose them

538
00:23:54,190 --> 00:23:52,820
unfortunately they're very noisy so we

539
00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:54,200
hear their voices even though they're

540
00:23:57,490 --> 00:23:55,850
probably only about two percent of the

541
00:24:00,370 --> 00:23:57,500
population at least in this country

542
00:24:02,170 --> 00:24:00,380
oppose vaccination but overwhelmingly we

543
00:24:04,180 --> 00:24:02,180
know that the the best option is to

544
00:24:05,950 --> 00:24:04,190
vaccination before we go to the

545
00:24:08,530 --> 00:24:05,960
scientific issues Rachel tell me about

546
00:24:10,180 --> 00:24:08,540
your own area of expertise and why

547
00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:10,190
vaccinations come to concern you as a

548
00:24:14,140 --> 00:24:12,410
scientist yeah look I'm not an

549
00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:14,150
immunologist I'm not a clinician I'm a

550
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:15,890
scientist and so I'm trained in

551
00:24:20,230 --> 00:24:18,290
clinically in analyzing scientific

552
00:24:22,750 --> 00:24:20,240
information and critically analyzing

553
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:22,760
scientific publications and so I became

554
00:24:26,980 --> 00:24:24,890
aware of the way that anti-vaccination

555
00:24:29,380 --> 00:24:26,990
people were cherry-picking the science

556
00:24:31,420 --> 00:24:29,390
if you like to use it to support their

557
00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:31,430
arguments and I'm able to look at what

558
00:24:35,590 --> 00:24:33,290
they present as scientific evidence and

559
00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:35,600
I'm able to determine that it's actually

560
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:38,330
not accurate and I became aware of this

561
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:42,170
in about 2009 when a young baby died in

562
00:24:46,300 --> 00:24:44,570
new south wales from whooping cough and

563
00:24:48,100 --> 00:24:46,310
the anti-vaccination movement in New

564
00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:48,110
South Wales attach the parents of this

565
00:24:52,890 --> 00:24:51,050
child because they were speaking out

566
00:24:55,510 --> 00:24:52,900
about the death of their daughter and

567
00:24:57,610 --> 00:24:55,520
advocating vaccination and I became very

568
00:24:59,320 --> 00:24:57,620
angry about that and a little bit upset

569
00:25:01,570 --> 00:24:59,330
and so since then I've been looking into

570
00:25:03,550 --> 00:25:01,580
the science and looking into the reasons

571
00:25:06,610 --> 00:25:03,560
why people oppose vaccines and that's

572
00:25:08,350 --> 00:25:06,620
where I came into this discussion my

573
00:25:09,340 --> 00:25:08,360
guest is dr. Rachel Dunlop from the

574
00:25:12,130 --> 00:25:09,350
school of medical and molecular

575
00:25:13,930 --> 00:25:12,140
Biosciences at UTS she's also vice

576
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:13,940
president of the Australian skeptics and

577
00:25:18,019 --> 00:25:15,210
she's become something of a care

578
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:18,029
pana against what she characterizes is

579
00:25:21,769 --> 00:25:20,010
the myths about vaccination you're on

580
00:25:23,120 --> 00:25:21,779
Triple 6abc Canberra and look I am

581
00:25:24,740 --> 00:25:23,130
interested in hearing from you on this

582
00:25:25,970 --> 00:25:24,750
if you've got thoughts on this whether

583
00:25:29,060 --> 00:25:25,980
there is a debate whether there should

584
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:29,070
be one 300 681 triple six is the number

585
00:25:35,899 --> 00:25:33,330
the SMS 04 679 double to triple six and

586
00:25:38,120 --> 00:25:35,909
Rachel let's go to the first most

587
00:25:40,100 --> 00:25:38,130
commonly quoted concern that vaccination

588
00:25:41,690 --> 00:25:40,110
is linked to autism now then that began

589
00:25:44,180 --> 00:25:41,700
with this study by british researcher

590
00:25:46,039 --> 00:25:44,190
Andrew Wakefield I recall very clearly

591
00:25:48,529 --> 00:25:46,049
sitting in this studio several years ago

592
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:48,539
when reports came out that the study had

593
00:25:53,389 --> 00:25:50,970
been comprehensively totally just

594
00:25:55,279 --> 00:25:53,399
debunked withdrawn by The Lancet that

595
00:25:57,980 --> 00:25:55,289
belief is still floating around though I

596
00:26:00,380 --> 00:25:57,990
know it's it's like an unsinkable rubber

597
00:26:02,570 --> 00:26:00,390
duck isn't it that that myth and I guess

598
00:26:04,549 --> 00:26:02,580
we know from scientific research now

599
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:04,559
that a lot of people get their

600
00:26:07,820 --> 00:26:06,450
information about vaccinations and in

601
00:26:09,769 --> 00:26:07,830
fact health from the internet and

602
00:26:11,510 --> 00:26:09,779
recently there was a study that came out

603
00:26:12,769 --> 00:26:11,520
showing that about forty-five percent of

604
00:26:14,690 --> 00:26:12,779
parents that are concerned about

605
00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:14,700
vaccines are getting their information

606
00:26:19,730 --> 00:26:17,490
online and we know that the internet is

607
00:26:21,380 --> 00:26:19,740
not regulated nobody goes in there and

608
00:26:23,380 --> 00:26:21,390
peer reviews it if you like so there's a

609
00:26:25,700 --> 00:26:23,390
lot of misinformation out there and

610
00:26:28,669 --> 00:26:25,710
absolutely that study has been retracted

611
00:26:30,100 --> 00:26:28,679
in fact that study never actually looked

612
00:26:32,779 --> 00:26:30,110
at a link between autism and vaccines

613
00:26:34,519 --> 00:26:32,789
but it was dr. andrew wakefield who has

614
00:26:37,490 --> 00:26:34,529
actually no longer a doctor by the way

615
00:26:39,260 --> 00:26:37,500
he was struck off the medical record but

616
00:26:41,090 --> 00:26:39,270
he said that at a press conference after

617
00:26:43,820 --> 00:26:41,100
that study was released and that was

618
00:26:46,370 --> 00:26:43,830
because he was paid by lawyers to

619
00:26:48,769 --> 00:26:46,380
discredit the MMR vaccine because he

620
00:26:51,710 --> 00:26:48,779
himself had a patent submitted for a

621
00:26:53,269 --> 00:26:51,720
single measles vaccine so he had so many

622
00:26:56,630 --> 00:26:53,279
conflicts of interest surrounding that

623
00:26:59,450 --> 00:26:56,640
study it wasn't funny and so there's not

624
00:27:00,799 --> 00:26:59,460
there's nothing that shows any good

625
00:27:03,919 --> 00:27:00,809
evidence that vaccines are linked to

626
00:27:05,690 --> 00:27:03,929
autism and as you say this this comes up

627
00:27:07,700 --> 00:27:05,700
on the internet search mechanism it's

628
00:27:10,100 --> 00:27:07,710
extraordinarily easy to manipulate that

629
00:27:11,990 --> 00:27:10,110
and it's not responsive to rankings of

630
00:27:13,610 --> 00:27:12,000
scientific credibility is that there's

631
00:27:15,409 --> 00:27:13,620
no sense that you're sort of picking up

632
00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:15,419
the most reliable study first know

633
00:27:19,460 --> 00:27:18,090
exactly and I think listeners should be

634
00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:19,470
aware that if you search if you're

635
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:20,970
looking for reliable information online

636
00:27:25,669 --> 00:27:23,610
if you search for immunization instead

637
00:27:28,220 --> 00:27:25,679
of vaccination you're more likely to

638
00:27:29,090 --> 00:27:28,230
find reliable information otherwise just

639
00:27:31,159 --> 00:27:29,100
go to immunize

640
00:27:32,539 --> 00:27:31,169
tralia or go to the Academy of Sciences

641
00:27:34,490 --> 00:27:32,549
there are websites around that are

642
00:27:35,870 --> 00:27:34,500
really helpful but just searching

643
00:27:38,180 --> 00:27:35,880
vaccinations online you get a lot of

644
00:27:40,130 --> 00:27:38,190
noise and a lot of it is not right now

645
00:27:41,870 --> 00:27:40,140
I've got a text from Oscar who says my

646
00:27:44,330 --> 00:27:41,880
kids risk side effects so that others

647
00:27:46,100 --> 00:27:44,340
can choose not to vaccinate now

648
00:27:48,529 --> 00:27:46,110
vaccination has meant as you were

649
00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:48,539
suggesting earlier that diseases like

650
00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:50,490
smallpox and polio have disappeared I

651
00:27:54,500 --> 00:27:52,770
think some people give themselves a

652
00:27:56,539 --> 00:27:54,510
leave pass on those vaccinations because

653
00:27:58,430 --> 00:27:56,549
they believe that no real further risk

654
00:28:01,029 --> 00:27:58,440
exists I mean is that a justifiable

655
00:28:03,049 --> 00:28:01,039
stance if you're worried about vaccines

656
00:28:04,750 --> 00:28:03,059
well you know the thing is these

657
00:28:07,580 --> 00:28:04,760
diseases haven't disappeared completely

658
00:28:09,980 --> 00:28:07,590
one that has is smallpox that has gone

659
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:09,990
it's in two freezers now in scientific

660
00:28:14,930 --> 00:28:11,490
laboratories but the others are still

661
00:28:16,700 --> 00:28:14,940
around and if we if we get complacent

662
00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:16,710
about vaccinating they will come back

663
00:28:21,590 --> 00:28:18,690
and we've just seen that recently in

664
00:28:23,180 --> 00:28:21,600
Wales in the UK where people became

665
00:28:25,399 --> 00:28:23,190
complacent about vaccinating for the

666
00:28:27,649 --> 00:28:25,409
measles mumps rubella after dr. Andrew

667
00:28:30,740 --> 00:28:27,659
Wakefield scare actually and now there's

668
00:28:33,500 --> 00:28:30,750
a huge explosion of measles in Wales as

669
00:28:35,029 --> 00:28:33,510
over a thousand cases now we also have a

670
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:35,039
lot of whooping cough around as well

671
00:28:39,289 --> 00:28:36,450
because adults are not getting their

672
00:28:41,899 --> 00:28:39,299
boosters for whooping cough so vaccines

673
00:28:43,730 --> 00:28:41,909
don't also give us a lifelong immunity

674
00:28:45,620 --> 00:28:43,740
in some cases particularly with the

675
00:28:47,539 --> 00:28:45,630
whooping cough vaccine so we need to get

676
00:28:49,220 --> 00:28:47,549
boosters so we have to be aware of these

677
00:28:51,470 --> 00:28:49,230
things I mean if we get complacent these

678
00:28:52,549 --> 00:28:51,480
diseases will come back and I think that

679
00:28:53,779 --> 00:28:52,559
Bill Gates actually made a really

680
00:28:56,990 --> 00:28:53,789
interesting point last night when he

681
00:28:58,549 --> 00:28:57,000
talked about how communities with

682
00:29:00,140 --> 00:28:58,559
similar interests tend to congregate

683
00:29:01,580 --> 00:29:00,150
together and so if you had for example a

684
00:29:03,620 --> 00:29:01,590
school where a significant number of

685
00:29:05,510 --> 00:29:03,630
children were unvaccinated then the

686
00:29:08,149 --> 00:29:05,520
impact of a measles epidemic there well

687
00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:08,159
it would indeed be an epidemic this is

688
00:29:11,419 --> 00:29:09,570
true and we've seen that happen in

689
00:29:13,490 --> 00:29:11,429
certain schools that don't condone

690
00:29:15,890 --> 00:29:13,500
vaccination it's happened in the UK

691
00:29:18,350 --> 00:29:15,900
quite a lot so yeah it's it's not

692
00:29:20,180 --> 00:29:18,360
something that and as I said before just

693
00:29:22,460 --> 00:29:20,190
because we don't see people dropping

694
00:29:24,799 --> 00:29:22,470
dead from polio doesn't mean that these

695
00:29:26,270 --> 00:29:24,809
diseases aren't around and it doesn't

696
00:29:28,460 --> 00:29:26,280
mean that they won't come back if we get

697
00:29:29,690 --> 00:29:28,470
complacent and they'd certainly will now

698
00:29:32,029 --> 00:29:29,700
I've got a caller on the line you okay

699
00:29:34,820 --> 00:29:32,039
to go to a call absolutely John's with

700
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:34,830
me John hello hello and John you'd like

701
00:29:37,310 --> 00:29:36,330
to question this idea you you're

702
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:37,320
wondering about the link between

703
00:29:42,830 --> 00:29:40,890
vaccinations and autism well first I

704
00:29:44,780 --> 00:29:42,840
just like to make the point that

705
00:29:46,820 --> 00:29:44,790
for these people worry about having kids

706
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:46,830
turn up at school on back so or if their

707
00:29:49,910 --> 00:29:48,090
kids are excited what are they going to

708
00:29:51,980 --> 00:29:49,920
worry about and look we will go to that

709
00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:51,990
but have you got a speeding at the point

710
00:29:58,180 --> 00:29:54,450
on yeah I'm making is that okay there's

711
00:30:02,300 --> 00:29:58,190
been an explosion in recent times in

712
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:02,310
what autism is is is increased at a rate

713
00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:04,170
which is considered be almost like at

714
00:30:08,990 --> 00:30:06,690
epidemic proportions a copy of it you

715
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:09,000
know blamed on genes as the same thing

716
00:30:12,530 --> 00:30:10,530
with a lot of the autoimmune diseases

717
00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:12,540
they've exploded like when I was a kid

718
00:30:17,150 --> 00:30:14,850
no one ever killed over from you know

719
00:30:19,310 --> 00:30:17,160
eating peanuts or anything like that so

720
00:30:22,010 --> 00:30:19,320
there's these diseases around now they

721
00:30:24,890 --> 00:30:22,020
happen to coincide with a big increase

722
00:30:27,470 --> 00:30:24,900
in the number of vaccines given the kids

723
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:27,480
no not saying as other people are

724
00:30:32,660 --> 00:30:29,490
there's a direct connection but I'm

725
00:30:35,380 --> 00:30:32,670
saying how do you know that there's no

726
00:30:38,900 --> 00:30:35,390
connection between this explosion in

727
00:30:40,790 --> 00:30:38,910
autoimmune disease and autism and the

728
00:30:43,100 --> 00:30:40,800
vaccinations if you don't know what

729
00:30:46,010 --> 00:30:43,110
causes autism or what's caused this

730
00:30:48,290 --> 00:30:46,020
spike in autoimmune illnesses among

731
00:30:50,540 --> 00:30:48,300
children which is actually a very fair

732
00:30:52,550 --> 00:30:50,550
question John Thank You Rachel over to

733
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:52,560
you yeah I think John makes an

734
00:30:56,780 --> 00:30:54,450
interesting point and that is that there

735
00:30:59,630 --> 00:30:56,790
is a huge increase in autism recently

736
00:31:01,670 --> 00:30:59,640
but people make the connection that kids

737
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:01,680
get vaccines kids get autism well you

738
00:31:04,610 --> 00:31:02,970
know there's been a huge increase in the

739
00:31:06,890 --> 00:31:04,620
number of mobile phones that people use

740
00:31:08,510 --> 00:31:06,900
that doesn't mean they cause autism but

741
00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:08,520
we know John John's point there to be

742
00:31:11,630 --> 00:31:10,050
fair was that if we don't know what

743
00:31:13,670 --> 00:31:11,640
causes autism how do we know that there

744
00:31:16,010 --> 00:31:13,680
isn't a connection with vaccinations

745
00:31:17,420 --> 00:31:16,020
fair enough and you know what scientists

746
00:31:19,610 --> 00:31:17,430
have looked at that and they've looked a

747
00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:19,620
bit thoroughly and the reason why we've

748
00:31:24,140 --> 00:31:20,970
looked at it is because Wakefield

749
00:31:25,790 --> 00:31:24,150
suggested that in 1998 since then there

750
00:31:27,260 --> 00:31:25,800
have been dozens and dozens of studies

751
00:31:29,510 --> 00:31:27,270
looking at whether there's a link

752
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:29,520
between vaccines and autism the larger

753
00:31:33,470 --> 00:31:31,410
study was done in Denmark it involved

754
00:31:35,450 --> 00:31:33,480
half a million children it looked at the

755
00:31:37,670 --> 00:31:35,460
difference between development in kids

756
00:31:39,980 --> 00:31:37,680
that have had the MMR vaccine and kids

757
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:39,990
that hadn't in fact there was no link

758
00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:42,210
between vaccines and autism we've also

759
00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:45,930
looked at a about 12,000 studies the

760
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:47,490
Institute of Medicine in the US has

761
00:31:50,660 --> 00:31:49,410
looked at this and they've found that

762
00:31:52,090 --> 00:31:50,670
there's no link between vaccines and

763
00:31:54,470 --> 00:31:52,100
autism that has been absolutely

764
00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:54,480
demonstrated by science and i think that

765
00:31:56,630 --> 00:31:56,010
the coincidence here rachel is that the

766
00:31:58,010 --> 00:31:56,640
symptoms of all

767
00:31:59,750 --> 00:31:58,020
some often emerge at about the same time

768
00:32:01,850 --> 00:31:59,760
that people have D vaccinations yeah

769
00:32:03,770 --> 00:32:01,860
it's unfortunate and the the the thing

770
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:03,780
that um the thing about genes is there

771
00:32:07,010 --> 00:32:05,250
is some connection to genes we don't

772
00:32:10,310 --> 00:32:07,020
know exactly yet what causes autism and

773
00:32:12,170 --> 00:32:10,320
that is a problem but it used to be that

774
00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:12,180
autism was diagnosed will around the age

775
00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:14,130
of 2 we're beginning as scientists

776
00:32:17,540 --> 00:32:15,690
beginning to get to a stage where we can

777
00:32:19,460 --> 00:32:17,550
do it earlier at around six months and

778
00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:19,470
that is going to make it less likely

779
00:32:22,490 --> 00:32:20,730
that people will make that connection

780
00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:22,500
but it is an unfortunate coincidence

781
00:32:26,060 --> 00:32:24,330
because that's the way it happened yes

782
00:32:27,470 --> 00:32:26,070
and actually a much earlier diagnosis of

783
00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:27,480
autism would be a really interesting

784
00:32:31,700 --> 00:32:29,730
endeavor if we looked at how this all

785
00:32:33,350 --> 00:32:31,710
works out Oscar says the reason John's

786
00:32:35,630 --> 00:32:33,360
kids can go around and vaccinated is

787
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:35,640
because mine are steve says I'm in my

788
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:37,530
40s I still remember how sick I was with

789
00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:39,450
measles and chicken pox these never

790
00:32:42,380 --> 00:32:40,890
killed any of the neighborhood kids but

791
00:32:44,690 --> 00:32:42,390
there was a deaf girl his mum had

792
00:32:46,850 --> 00:32:44,700
rubella in pregnancy and of course that

793
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:46,860
the birth defects are another important

794
00:32:50,810 --> 00:32:48,810
link here Rachel that measles didn't

795
00:32:51,950 --> 00:32:50,820
kill me either but it's something that

796
00:32:53,810 --> 00:32:51,960
could have had profound lifelong

797
00:32:55,670 --> 00:32:53,820
consequences rubella certainly for

798
00:32:56,870 --> 00:32:55,680
people's well-being yeah and this is the

799
00:32:58,700 --> 00:32:56,880
thing that kind of annoys me about

800
00:33:01,520 --> 00:32:58,710
people that oppose vaccinations they

801
00:33:03,950 --> 00:33:01,530
cite well you know people stopped dying

802
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:03,960
from infectious diseases before vaccines

803
00:33:08,300 --> 00:33:05,370
were introduced well yes they stopped

804
00:33:10,220 --> 00:33:08,310
dying for to some extent because we got

805
00:33:12,530 --> 00:33:10,230
in create improved water we got improved

806
00:33:14,660 --> 00:33:12,540
sewage but they didn't stop getting the

807
00:33:16,730 --> 00:33:14,670
disease so they didn't stop getting you

808
00:33:20,060 --> 00:33:16,740
know long-term suffering and effects

809
00:33:21,530 --> 00:33:20,070
like deafness etc so it's important that

810
00:33:23,150 --> 00:33:21,540
we remember when we talk about these

811
00:33:24,860 --> 00:33:23,160
infectious diseases they don't just kill

812
00:33:26,660 --> 00:33:24,870
people they give them a long term

813
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:26,670
complications and long-term effects that

814
00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:29,010
can also be very bad is it true though

815
00:33:32,030 --> 00:33:30,450
that more vaccinated people get the

816
00:33:33,410 --> 00:33:32,040
diseases that unvaccinated or is that

817
00:33:36,890 --> 00:33:33,420
essentially a manipulation of the

818
00:33:39,380 --> 00:33:36,900
numbers once again it is I mean it's

819
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:39,390
true that more people get their can get

820
00:33:44,540 --> 00:33:42,410
the disease but percentage-wise no and

821
00:33:46,820 --> 00:33:44,550
this is a little bit complicated but

822
00:33:48,590 --> 00:33:46,830
it's because not all vaccines are one

823
00:33:50,630 --> 00:33:48,600
hundred percent effective and not all

824
00:33:52,490 --> 00:33:50,640
people respond to them one hundred

825
00:33:54,590 --> 00:33:52,500
percent effectively so if there is an

826
00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:54,600
outbreak if you're vaccinated you might

827
00:33:57,950 --> 00:33:56,130
still pick up the disease I me no

828
00:33:59,600 --> 00:33:57,960
vaccines not like a force field you can

829
00:34:01,610 --> 00:33:59,610
still like touch a door or open

830
00:34:04,220 --> 00:34:01,620
something and pick up a bacteria or a

831
00:34:06,050 --> 00:34:04,230
virus but you will get a much less

832
00:34:09,350 --> 00:34:06,060
severe cater the disease and the

833
00:34:10,579 --> 00:34:09,360
duration will be shorter in all cases in

834
00:34:11,690 --> 00:34:10,589
studies that have shown

835
00:34:12,829 --> 00:34:11,700
that have looked at the difference

836
00:34:15,469 --> 00:34:12,839
between vaccinated and unvaccinated

837
00:34:17,899 --> 00:34:15,479
people the only difference is that

838
00:34:20,209 --> 00:34:17,909
vaccinate unvaccinated people get more

839
00:34:22,459 --> 00:34:20,219
vaccine-preventable diseases it's pretty

840
00:34:23,899 --> 00:34:22,469
obvious vaccinations not mandatory we

841
00:34:25,549 --> 00:34:23,909
can't make that happen we can only rely

842
00:34:27,829 --> 00:34:25,559
on public health campaigns to enforce

843
00:34:29,930 --> 00:34:27,839
the idea that it really matters but if

844
00:34:31,909 --> 00:34:29,940
you do decide otherwise if you are

845
00:34:34,849 --> 00:34:31,919
willing to take the risk when then why

846
00:34:36,649 --> 00:34:34,859
is that anyone else's business it's

847
00:34:39,259 --> 00:34:36,659
because of this thing we call community

848
00:34:41,359 --> 00:34:39,269
immunity if you like and it's I guess in

849
00:34:43,099 --> 00:34:41,369
my opinion I think vaccination is a

850
00:34:45,349 --> 00:34:43,109
social responsibility not just a

851
00:34:46,639 --> 00:34:45,359
personal choice and that's because there

852
00:34:48,289 --> 00:34:46,649
are a lot of people in the community who

853
00:34:50,959 --> 00:34:48,299
can't be vaccinated or they're too young

854
00:34:53,029 --> 00:34:50,969
to be vaccinated now I mentioned earlier

855
00:34:55,159 --> 00:34:53,039
that I became involved in this issue

856
00:34:57,319 --> 00:34:55,169
when I heard of a four week old baby who

857
00:34:59,150 --> 00:34:57,329
died of pertussis now for week all

858
00:35:01,430 --> 00:34:59,160
babies are too young to be vaccinated so

859
00:35:04,309 --> 00:35:01,440
they are unprotected and they can't be

860
00:35:07,670 --> 00:35:04,319
vaccinated but if we as a community are

861
00:35:09,529 --> 00:35:07,680
all vaccinated then we buy our community

862
00:35:11,690 --> 00:35:09,539
immunity can help prevent those diseases

863
00:35:14,029 --> 00:35:11,700
take hold in a in a part of the

864
00:35:15,499 --> 00:35:14,039
community Maria so that I had whooping

865
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:15,509
cough two years ago I can't imagine how

866
00:35:19,910 --> 00:35:17,729
baby could survive it yeah well you know

867
00:35:22,009 --> 00:35:19,920
what we do it to protect people that are

868
00:35:23,359 --> 00:35:22,019
that can't be vaccinated or a vulnerable

869
00:35:25,940 --> 00:35:23,369
because maybe they've got an autoimmune

870
00:35:27,019 --> 00:35:25,950
disease they've got their having cancer

871
00:35:29,390 --> 00:35:27,029
therapy they're getting chemotherapy

872
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:29,400
those people that can't be vaccinated if

873
00:35:33,229 --> 00:35:31,650
they have an egg allergy for example we

874
00:35:35,509 --> 00:35:33,239
protect everybody else if we're all

875
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:35,519
vaccinated another question via the SMS

876
00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:37,410
should older people be revaccinated and

877
00:35:42,019 --> 00:35:39,690
if so which ones yeah really good

878
00:35:43,729 --> 00:35:42,029
question um well in particular with the

879
00:35:46,549 --> 00:35:43,739
whooping cough vaccine it doesn't last

880
00:35:48,259 --> 00:35:46,559
forever and this is being a real problem

881
00:35:49,910 --> 00:35:48,269
recently because it's estimated that

882
00:35:52,069 --> 00:35:49,920
only about eleven percent of adults are

883
00:35:54,620 --> 00:35:52,079
actually covered or immune to whooping

884
00:35:56,870 --> 00:35:54,630
cough I had my booster recently everyone

885
00:35:58,130 --> 00:35:56,880
should get their booster because we need

886
00:36:00,109 --> 00:35:58,140
to protect those people that are too

887
00:36:02,870 --> 00:36:00,119
young or unable to be vaccinated against

888
00:36:05,180 --> 00:36:02,880
whooping cough and another text saying

889
00:36:06,799 --> 00:36:05,190
anything believable is there an increase

890
00:36:09,109 --> 00:36:06,809
in autism because the simply an increase

891
00:36:11,469 --> 00:36:09,119
in diagnosis of autism and their yeah

892
00:36:14,719 --> 00:36:11,479
that's part of it as well actually yeah

893
00:36:17,269 --> 00:36:14,729
indeed do vaccines actually contain

894
00:36:19,190 --> 00:36:17,279
toxins Rachel well they contain

895
00:36:21,140 --> 00:36:19,200
chemicals and everything contains

896
00:36:23,299 --> 00:36:21,150
chemicals we're made of chemicals by the

897
00:36:24,620 --> 00:36:23,309
way you know water is a chemical the air

898
00:36:26,030 --> 00:36:24,630
is a chemical

899
00:36:28,220 --> 00:36:26,040
all these things are there for a reason

900
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:28,230
and they're at levels that are so low

901
00:36:33,830 --> 00:36:30,170
that they're not going to cause toxicity

902
00:36:35,810 --> 00:36:33,840
so it's kind of like the the dose the

903
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:35,820
poison is in the dose you know you can

904
00:36:39,860 --> 00:36:37,050
actually die from drinking too much

905
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:39,870
water believe it or not so this there's

906
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:41,490
very low levels of some things in

907
00:36:44,390 --> 00:36:43,050
vaccines that are there for a reason but

908
00:36:46,940 --> 00:36:44,400
they're not going to cause any problems

909
00:36:48,740 --> 00:36:46,950
because they're very low Rachel you have

910
00:36:50,720 --> 00:36:48,750
been extensively really heavily

911
00:36:53,420 --> 00:36:50,730
criticized by opponents of vaccination

912
00:36:56,630 --> 00:36:53,430
and yes quick quick search on the you

913
00:36:57,620 --> 00:36:56,640
get someone else well in it day but you

914
00:37:00,020 --> 00:36:57,630
know happy to give you the opportunity

915
00:37:02,570 --> 00:37:00,030
to receive more of that criticism thanks

916
00:37:04,310 --> 00:37:02,580
but how do you respond to opponents of

917
00:37:06,530 --> 00:37:04,320
vaccination who say look this is a free

918
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:06,540
choice I'm making up my own mind on the

919
00:37:11,510 --> 00:37:08,370
basis of my research I believe in this

920
00:37:13,130 --> 00:37:11,520
very sincerely and very genuinely you

921
00:37:14,570 --> 00:37:13,140
know I don't actually try to reach out

922
00:37:15,980 --> 00:37:14,580
to those people because they've made up

923
00:37:18,050 --> 00:37:15,990
their mind and they're not going to be

924
00:37:20,720 --> 00:37:18,060
influenced at all what I try to do with

925
00:37:23,090 --> 00:37:20,730
my scientific communication is reach

926
00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:23,100
those people who are confused or may

927
00:37:26,240 --> 00:37:24,210
have read some stuff on the internet

928
00:37:27,980 --> 00:37:26,250
that made them worried and that's

929
00:37:29,630 --> 00:37:27,990
roughly around thirty to forty five

930
00:37:32,330 --> 00:37:29,640
percent of parents based on a recent

931
00:37:34,940 --> 00:37:32,340
study so I hope that from the work that

932
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:34,950
I do it enables people to look at the

933
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:36,810
facts and at the science and make a

934
00:37:41,750 --> 00:37:39,210
decision based on rational scientific

935
00:37:43,100 --> 00:37:41,760
information it's it's a highly emotive

936
00:37:45,350 --> 00:37:43,110
debate in some quarters though isn't it

937
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:45,360
Rachel yeah it is it's it's incredibly

938
00:37:50,540 --> 00:37:48,210
nasty as well but someone's got to do it

939
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:50,550
so I'm taking one for the team has that

940
00:37:54,470 --> 00:37:52,410
been your experience that you get a

941
00:37:56,090 --> 00:37:54,480
really personally nasty response from

942
00:37:57,890 --> 00:37:56,100
people who opposed to vaccinations well

943
00:38:00,170 --> 00:37:57,900
look absolutely and if anyone saw the

944
00:38:03,170 --> 00:38:00,180
front pages of the Telegraph on Sunday

945
00:38:05,090 --> 00:38:03,180
in New South Wales Tony McCaffrey who

946
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:05,100
whose daughter died of whooping cough in

947
00:38:10,730 --> 00:38:07,770
2009 she was describing how she was

948
00:38:12,620 --> 00:38:10,740
vilified by anti-vaccination opponents

949
00:38:14,570 --> 00:38:12,630
and you know when her daughter died she

950
00:38:16,580 --> 00:38:14,580
was told to harden up and that you know

951
00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:16,590
in fact some one of those people rang

952
00:38:21,020 --> 00:38:18,810
the health department to find out if her

953
00:38:23,870 --> 00:38:21,030
daughter really died from Pat asses so

954
00:38:25,580 --> 00:38:23,880
this stuff is just absolutely awful and

955
00:38:27,620 --> 00:38:25,590
for four years she's been harassed

956
00:38:29,150 --> 00:38:27,630
harassed harassed by these people but

957
00:38:31,190 --> 00:38:29,160
they don't seem to care and they don't

958
00:38:35,660 --> 00:38:31,200
seem to think it's a problem with with a

959
00:38:37,370 --> 00:38:35,670
dead infant yes yes and let me and to

960
00:38:38,390 --> 00:38:37,380
this day those people are still writing

961
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:38,400
blogs about it and

962
00:38:41,750 --> 00:38:39,930
ending the fact that they called the

963
00:38:44,720 --> 00:38:41,760
health department and said we want to

964
00:38:46,250 --> 00:38:44,730
see her autopsy reports because that's

965
00:38:47,750 --> 00:38:46,260
what you do when your baby dies you

966
00:38:49,789 --> 00:38:47,760
pretend that it's from something else

967
00:38:52,279 --> 00:38:49,799
for your own causes that's yeah and you

968
00:38:54,589 --> 00:38:52,289
also say supposedly died of pertussis

969
00:38:56,599 --> 00:38:54,599
and then you send email saying well it's

970
00:39:00,140 --> 00:38:56,609
your fault because you didn't breastfeed

971
00:39:02,120 --> 00:39:00,150
her or it it's just I you know it's it's

972
00:39:04,279 --> 00:39:02,130
so abhorrent that it just it beggars

973
00:39:05,900 --> 00:39:04,289
belief this says wonderful to hear this

974
00:39:09,019 --> 00:39:05,910
support for vaccination you keep up the

975
00:39:11,630 --> 00:39:09,029
good work Rachel Rachel really I thank

976
00:39:14,539 --> 00:39:11,640
you talk to you about this and and thank

977
00:39:16,849 --> 00:39:14,549
you for for applying a very scientific

978
00:39:18,260 --> 00:39:16,859
razor to all the debate that surrounds

979
00:39:19,460 --> 00:39:18,270
all of this we appreciate your time very

980
00:39:20,930 --> 00:39:19,470
much and thank you for having me I

981
00:39:23,569 --> 00:39:20,940
appreciate the opportunity my pleasure

982
00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:23,579
thanks Rachel bye bye bye dr. Rachel

983
00:39:27,049 --> 00:39:24,930
Dunlop from the school of medical and

984
00:39:29,299 --> 00:39:27,059
molecular Biosciences at UTS and if

985
00:39:32,420 --> 00:39:29,309
you're interested in in her contentions

986
00:39:34,849 --> 00:39:32,430
six myths about vaccination is on the

987
00:39:36,799 --> 00:39:34,859
conversation website it's the most read

988
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:36,809
article this week and well worth a look

989
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:51,350
nice antidote industry skeptic zone

990
00:39:59,330 --> 00:39:54,930
bascially suit ohmeda won't escape toy

991
00:40:02,630 --> 00:39:59,340
talk on da CA n sceptile Shigure crucial

992
00:40:05,450 --> 00:40:02,640
a podcast llamo o momentito with her own

993
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:05,460
see no party pocket and Helios in the

994
00:40:11,870 --> 00:40:08,370
atlantic ocean in maroon rajesh

995
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:11,880
attention chatty Lana cncl link Li Dao

996
00:40:17,980 --> 00:40:15,330
itunes the Chihuahua Jan SATA sceptile

997
00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:17,990
puta chiffon well one of the ones

998
00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:25,310
the script I'd science podcast by Brian

999
00:40:30,170 --> 00:40:27,690
Dungey is now available for Chinese

1000
00:40:33,740 --> 00:40:30,180
audience please tell your Chinese

1001
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:33,750
friends to visit skipped item the CN a

1002
00:40:52,450 --> 00:40:36,570
fine skip toyed and the Chinese itunes

1003
00:40:58,190 --> 00:40:54,920
welcome to a week in science from our

1004
00:41:01,760 --> 00:40:58,200
iOS this week seeing inside molecules

1005
00:41:11,210 --> 00:41:01,770
playing cupid for balls and tiny ancient

1006
00:41:13,790 --> 00:41:11,220
primates first up an imaging technique

1007
00:41:16,580 --> 00:41:13,800
that allows us to see inside molecules

1008
00:41:18,800 --> 00:41:16,590
molecules are currently identified by

1009
00:41:21,530 --> 00:41:18,810
detecting signature vibrations that are

1010
00:41:23,660 --> 00:41:21,540
unique like fingerprints japanese

1011
00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:23,670
researchers have enhanced this technique

1012
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:26,010
so it's sensitive enough to map the

1013
00:41:31,100 --> 00:41:28,770
structure of an individual molecule this

1014
00:41:33,380 --> 00:41:31,110
high res method could allow us to

1015
00:41:37,270 --> 00:41:33,390
actually build molecules from scratch

1016
00:41:39,380 --> 00:41:37,280
and change their functionality

1017
00:41:41,900 --> 00:41:39,390
researchers have played Cupid with

1018
00:41:44,660 --> 00:41:41,910
prairie voles using a special love drug

1019
00:41:47,240 --> 00:41:44,670
voles are one of very few monogamous

1020
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:47,250
animals forming lifelong pair bonds

1021
00:41:51,530 --> 00:41:49,530
bonding naturally occurs after mating

1022
00:41:53,420 --> 00:41:51,540
when changes to the voles gene

1023
00:41:55,940 --> 00:41:53,430
structures trigger the release of

1024
00:41:58,070 --> 00:41:55,950
certain love hormones scientists

1025
00:42:00,440 --> 00:41:58,080
injected female prairie voles with a

1026
00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:00,450
drug that made these genes trigger the

1027
00:42:05,120 --> 00:42:02,610
hormone release causing them to pair off

1028
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:05,130
without ever mating I wonder if that

1029
00:42:14,930 --> 00:42:11,990
a climate change data review suggests

1030
00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:14,940
that ice loss in Antarctica may be less

1031
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:16,890
than previously predicted while in

1032
00:42:20,930 --> 00:42:19,050
Greenland it may be more general

1033
00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:20,940
anesthetic could increase the risk of

1034
00:42:25,430 --> 00:42:23,850
dementia in elderly patients astronomers

1035
00:42:28,490 --> 00:42:25,440
have photographed a never-before-seen

1036
00:42:30,710 --> 00:42:28,500
gaseous planet orbiting its star three

1037
00:42:32,990 --> 00:42:30,720
hundred light-years away and male ly

1038
00:42:35,090 --> 00:42:33,000
beds coordinate song and dance moves in

1039
00:42:37,430 --> 00:42:35,100
their courtship displays a level of

1040
00:42:42,260 --> 00:42:37,440
sophistication previously known only in

1041
00:42:45,010 --> 00:42:42,270
humans wrapping up this week let's step

1042
00:42:47,270 --> 00:42:45,020
55 million years into the past

1043
00:42:49,340 --> 00:42:47,280
scientists have discovered the oldest

1044
00:42:51,740 --> 00:42:49,350
nearly complete skeleton of a tiny

1045
00:42:54,380 --> 00:42:51,750
primate it was about seven centimeters

1046
00:42:56,690 --> 00:42:54,390
long weighing no more than 30 grams as

1047
00:42:59,000 --> 00:42:56,700
small as a modern pygmy mouse lemur

1048
00:43:01,940 --> 00:42:59,010
features of the skeleton suggests it was

1049
00:43:04,190 --> 00:43:01,950
a frequently / had good vision and ate

1050
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:04,200
insects this discovery helps us

1051
00:43:08,450 --> 00:43:05,850
understand the early evolution of

1052
00:43:12,440 --> 00:43:08,460
primates and when they split from human

1053
00:43:14,540 --> 00:43:12,450
ancestors we cover lots of health

1054
00:43:16,510 --> 00:43:14,550
stories on a week in science and our

1055
00:43:19,970 --> 00:43:16,520
upcoming event Lost in Translation

1056
00:43:21,740 --> 00:43:19,980
delves even deeper on jun 19 we'll look

1057
00:43:23,450 --> 00:43:21,750
at the barriers that stop cutting edge

1058
00:43:25,700 --> 00:43:23,460
health research from reaching health

1059
00:43:27,470 --> 00:43:25,710
care practice you can join the audience

1060
00:43:30,109 --> 00:43:27,480
in Adelaide or tune in to the live

1061
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:30,119
stream online details on the rirs

1062
00:43:34,010 --> 00:43:32,010
website that's been the highlights of

1063
00:43:36,260 --> 00:43:34,020
another big week in science for more

1064
00:43:39,890 --> 00:43:36,270
information and science news jump onto

1065
00:43:41,900 --> 00:43:39,900
the rars website at arias org dot a you

1066
00:43:44,630 --> 00:43:41,910
where you can also sign up for

1067
00:43:46,820 --> 00:43:44,640
notifications of future episodes don't

1068
00:43:50,060 --> 00:43:46,830
forget follow a week insight on twitter

1069
00:43:52,310 --> 00:43:50,070
using the hashtag week inside I'm Tony

1070
00:44:04,930 --> 00:43:52,320
Amaya and on behalf of the our iOS team

1071
00:44:10,900 --> 00:44:07,839
I'm courses hello an ally Dawson to her

1072
00:44:12,790 --> 00:44:10,910
at the skeptics on podcasts vossted here

1073
00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:12,800
this is alvin Dutch Manannan skeptic a

1074
00:44:18,359 --> 00:44:14,690
fab and gift for vital information

1075
00:44:23,349 --> 00:44:18,369
newborns on the skeptic a magazine bucht

1076
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:23,359
vvv point gavey oop a punk talk hv

1077
00:44:29,500 --> 00:44:26,690
dejala vay vay vay pumped give a rupee

1078
00:44:40,970 --> 00:44:29,510
Paul talk on tons of it say on facebook

1079
00:44:48,660 --> 00:44:46,140
here's my not spooky action at the

1080
00:44:52,900 --> 00:44:51,220
well they've remodeled the usual studio

1081
00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:52,910
we have here at skeptics in the pub they

1082
00:44:56,230 --> 00:44:54,890
used to be like a library book and all

1083
00:44:58,480 --> 00:44:56,240
this stuff but it's gotten all funky now

1084
00:45:00,430 --> 00:44:58,490
it looks like a disco and in fact I

1085
00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:00,440
think some ecstasy I bought off a

1086
00:45:04,660 --> 00:45:02,690
backpacker in 1989 is just coming on

1087
00:45:06,580 --> 00:45:04,670
right now we have a few people walking

1088
00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:06,590
through the studio but any regulars into

1089
00:45:10,300 --> 00:45:07,970
this show will know that's what happens

1090
00:45:12,430 --> 00:45:10,310
and who's our special guest today oh and

1091
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:12,440
dr. Paul Willis hello hello how are you

1092
00:45:15,850 --> 00:45:14,210
you know you're normally based in South

1093
00:45:17,230 --> 00:45:15,860
Australia actually looking three inches

1094
00:45:19,090 --> 00:45:17,240
taller than the last time I saw you I

1095
00:45:20,830 --> 00:45:19,100
know I'm it's the shoes it's I would it

1096
00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:20,840
is a haircut I think this hair kind of

1097
00:45:23,530 --> 00:45:22,130
minds a bit of a conspiracy well I don't

1098
00:45:26,230 --> 00:45:23,540
know who you borrowed it from but I'll

1099
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:26,240
get your money back Oh agent Cooper Kyle

1100
00:45:30,820 --> 00:45:28,610
MacLachlan I think I ended up with Mad

1101
00:45:33,910 --> 00:45:30,830
Max no I think it's just retreating but

1102
00:45:36,100 --> 00:45:33,920
look at could be you've journeyed far

1103
00:45:38,650 --> 00:45:36,110
and wide from South Australia here I've

1104
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:38,660
been on the road actually for a week and

1105
00:45:44,260 --> 00:45:41,810
a half I was in Canberra at the academy

1106
00:45:47,770 --> 00:45:44,270
of sciences talking about how you take

1107
00:45:49,060 --> 00:45:47,780
stories to programs like catalyst then I

1108
00:45:50,950 --> 00:45:49,070
went off to Brisbane where I pulled

1109
00:45:53,590 --> 00:45:50,960
apart a duck looking for the insert for

1110
00:45:56,740 --> 00:45:53,600
the dinosaur inside and I came here over

1111
00:45:58,630 --> 00:45:56,750
here to Sydney and I've been doing a

1112
00:46:00,400 --> 00:45:58,640
number of things here including some

1113
00:46:04,090 --> 00:46:00,410
work with the BBC you must be exhausted

1114
00:46:06,100 --> 00:46:04,100
I am I'm completely knackered but look

1115
00:46:07,720 --> 00:46:06,110
it's all part of the job another under

1116
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:07,730
Ector at the Royal Institution there in

1117
00:46:11,890 --> 00:46:10,130
Adelaide my job is to get out and spruik

1118
00:46:13,300 --> 00:46:11,900
science around the country now what are

1119
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:13,310
you doing with the BBC everyone's going

1120
00:46:17,680 --> 00:46:16,010
all hang on what does the undo okay that

1121
00:46:19,990 --> 00:46:17,690
wasn't a neat one to drop in there on

1122
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:20,000
there look the BBC are actually putting

1123
00:46:25,900 --> 00:46:22,450
together a walking with dinosaurs

1124
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:25,910
experience that'll to around the

1125
00:46:30,730 --> 00:46:27,770
shopping centers of I think it's

1126
00:46:32,410 --> 00:46:30,740
Westfield and it's a case for you know

1127
00:46:33,940 --> 00:46:32,420
you can bring the kids along and they

1128
00:46:36,070 --> 00:46:33,950
can actually go and dig up some dinosaur

1129
00:46:37,780 --> 00:46:36,080
bones cuz kids love dinosaurs course

1130
00:46:39,370 --> 00:46:37,790
they love dinosaur and so do you you've

1131
00:46:41,020 --> 00:46:39,380
done a bit of a pallet of it you've done

1132
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:41,030
some paleontology digging heaven heaven

1133
00:46:44,860 --> 00:46:43,010
d actually I found a dinosaur recently

1134
00:46:46,300 --> 00:46:44,870
in Canberra but that's another story so

1135
00:46:48,850 --> 00:46:46,310
long story you can pick up on the side

1136
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:48,860
show but anyway so we did this thing

1137
00:46:53,980 --> 00:46:52,010
with the with the BBC and that'll be

1138
00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:53,990
going out across the country shopping

1139
00:46:56,760 --> 00:46:55,210
center near you

1140
00:46:59,849 --> 00:46:56,770
they have walking with dinosaurs on ice

1141
00:47:01,380 --> 00:46:59,859
with in recent memory yes they did I

1142
00:47:03,599 --> 00:47:01,390
don't know about on ice they did have a

1143
00:47:06,540 --> 00:47:03,609
stage oh yeah it was really well done

1144
00:47:09,570 --> 00:47:06,550
actually you know because it's it's not

1145
00:47:12,390 --> 00:47:09,580
easy operating you know a 13 meets a

1146
00:47:14,700 --> 00:47:12,400
long puppet of a dinosaur and it's

1147
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:14,710
getting kids away from something else

1148
00:47:19,770 --> 00:47:18,010
that's not science yeah look the filling

1149
00:47:21,660 --> 00:47:19,780
them away from the mcdonalds ads between

1150
00:47:24,329 --> 00:47:21,670
the show the thing with dinosaurs but

1151
00:47:26,700 --> 00:47:24,339
also with astronomy and Egyptology is

1152
00:47:28,829 --> 00:47:26,710
for a lot of kids it's their first

1153
00:47:30,870 --> 00:47:28,839
experience of science it's their first

1154
00:47:33,210 --> 00:47:30,880
experience of abstract thinking I've

1155
00:47:35,670 --> 00:47:33,220
come across kids who can't spell our own

1156
00:47:38,070 --> 00:47:35,680
name but I can spell Tyrannosaurus kids

1157
00:47:41,579 --> 00:47:38,080
who aren't even sure why they're alive

1158
00:47:44,280 --> 00:47:41,589
but they come to terms of the idea of

1159
00:47:47,099 --> 00:47:44,290
extinction or things that lived before I

1160
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:47,109
was alive and you only think about it

1161
00:47:52,920 --> 00:47:50,010
they're powerful ideas to play with and

1162
00:47:54,690 --> 00:47:52,930
it's something about dinosaurs astronomy

1163
00:47:57,770 --> 00:47:54,700
in Egyptology that captured kids

1164
00:48:00,510 --> 00:47:57,780
imagination and once you've got that it

1165
00:48:02,730 --> 00:48:00,520
wonderful wonderful teaching tools you

1166
00:48:05,460 --> 00:48:02,740
can see to anything you know 22

1167
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:05,470
Tyrannosaurus is plus 3 brontosauruses

1168
00:48:11,010 --> 00:48:08,290
will equal there's a lot more fun than 2

1169
00:48:12,839 --> 00:48:11,020
plus 3 equals what now you do a number

1170
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:12,849
of outreach education projects you've

1171
00:48:15,599 --> 00:48:14,290
got the vodcast which will tell us about

1172
00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:15,609
in the moment and of course you have the

1173
00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:17,290
weekly on the skeptic zome have a weekly

1174
00:48:21,900 --> 00:48:19,210
catch up with what you're up to yeah

1175
00:48:24,300 --> 00:48:21,910
that's that that's actually the vodcast

1176
00:48:28,589 --> 00:48:24,310
we did we do we put the sound on the

1177
00:48:31,859 --> 00:48:28,599
podcast and it's a succinct easy to

1178
00:48:33,930 --> 00:48:31,869
digest summary of the news in science

1179
00:48:35,670 --> 00:48:33,940
for that week if you want more we've got

1180
00:48:38,040 --> 00:48:35,680
more on the website so that you know you

1181
00:48:40,349 --> 00:48:38,050
can go dig a bit deeper but we just have

1182
00:48:42,839 --> 00:48:40,359
fun putting up about a dozen of the best

1183
00:48:44,670 --> 00:48:42,849
science stories from the week and we do

1184
00:48:47,190 --> 00:48:44,680
put it out as a vodcast as well as a

1185
00:48:48,930 --> 00:48:47,200
podcast so that you can actually sit

1186
00:48:50,250 --> 00:48:48,940
there on the bus on you I home on a

1187
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:50,260
Friday night and if you've got three and

1188
00:48:54,450 --> 00:48:52,810
a half minutes you can watch the news in

1189
00:48:55,950 --> 00:48:54,460
science for that week I mean how could

1190
00:48:57,300 --> 00:48:55,960
that it's gotta leave the clips and

1191
00:48:58,829 --> 00:48:57,310
things being played yeah we've got all

1192
00:49:00,000 --> 00:48:58,839
the clips and all the visuals and all

1193
00:49:01,590 --> 00:49:00,010
that yeah now what

1194
00:49:03,480 --> 00:49:01,600
I want to ask you about is this is good

1195
00:49:05,820 --> 00:49:03,490
science education but what about a push

1196
00:49:08,130 --> 00:49:05,830
back against the pseudoscience what

1197
00:49:10,770 --> 00:49:08,140
about a show that not so much debunking

1198
00:49:12,720 --> 00:49:10,780
but has likely the the will of the week

1199
00:49:13,830 --> 00:49:12,730
or something like that and that but is

1200
00:49:15,150 --> 00:49:13,840
that beyond what you should be doing

1201
00:49:16,350 --> 00:49:15,160
well you just want to educate people

1202
00:49:18,630 --> 00:49:16,360
with the science and leave that to

1203
00:49:20,310 --> 00:49:18,640
someone else this takes me back to the

1204
00:49:22,590 --> 00:49:20,320
days of the cracks files remember them

1205
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:22,600
on triple j this this was this is my

1206
00:49:27,570 --> 00:49:25,330
first radio program on triple j now with

1207
00:49:30,090 --> 00:49:27,580
his precalc cruising is key I know

1208
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:30,100
Cole's there but I had the cracks files

1209
00:49:35,250 --> 00:49:32,410
they're from I think was nineteen

1210
00:49:36,900 --> 00:49:35,260
ninety-seven through to 999 and we

1211
00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:36,910
looked at all kinds of Wu and

1212
00:49:42,510 --> 00:49:38,650
pseudoscience and they're still there on

1213
00:49:46,110 --> 00:49:42,520
the on the internet cor re X on the ABC

1214
00:49:47,340 --> 00:49:46,120
science website and yeah we tackled

1215
00:49:51,300 --> 00:49:47,350
everything and had a lot of fun with

1216
00:49:53,760 --> 00:49:51,310
that but you look I moved on to other

1217
00:49:54,930 --> 00:49:53,770
things and so you think it's more

1218
00:49:56,880 --> 00:49:54,940
important to put the right information

1219
00:49:58,710 --> 00:49:56,890
out there and lead that sort of thing to

1220
00:50:01,380 --> 00:49:58,720
other people because it's better to get

1221
00:50:03,900 --> 00:50:01,390
what you do right first yeah look that

1222
00:50:08,520 --> 00:50:03,910
there is so much to be done as an mo you

1223
00:50:11,120 --> 00:50:08,530
know and I think that our our stick is

1224
00:50:14,670 --> 00:50:11,130
just to put out the good stuff you know

1225
00:50:16,860 --> 00:50:14,680
rather than get into brawls I mean every

1226
00:50:18,450 --> 00:50:16,870
so often will get dragged into climate

1227
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:18,460
change denial or something like that

1228
00:50:25,140 --> 00:50:22,810
because we don't as an institution we

1229
00:50:28,290 --> 00:50:25,150
don't have a position on any anything we

1230
00:50:30,690 --> 00:50:28,300
are not pro climate debate or climate

1231
00:50:34,050 --> 00:50:30,700
change or what we're not pro-nuclear

1232
00:50:36,240 --> 00:50:34,060
we're not pro or anti GMO or anything we

1233
00:50:38,820 --> 00:50:36,250
don't have any positions what we do is

1234
00:50:40,410 --> 00:50:38,830
we present the science this is the

1235
00:50:43,230 --> 00:50:40,420
science this is what the science says

1236
00:50:45,540 --> 00:50:43,240
this is how many people in science who

1237
00:50:47,760 --> 00:50:45,550
actually study the stuff say climate

1238
00:50:50,430 --> 00:50:47,770
change is real this is how many people

1239
00:50:52,950 --> 00:50:50,440
say that it is not real you know and

1240
00:50:55,410 --> 00:50:52,960
when you actually lay it out like that

1241
00:50:57,540 --> 00:50:55,420
then the public can see that well

1242
00:51:00,510 --> 00:50:57,550
there's not much debate about something

1243
00:51:01,860 --> 00:51:00,520
like climate change you know that the

1244
00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:01,870
Lord the paper came out the other day

1245
00:51:06,900 --> 00:51:04,450
ninety-seven percent of papers that deal

1246
00:51:08,700 --> 00:51:06,910
with climate change agree that the

1247
00:51:12,140 --> 00:51:08,710
climate change the climate is changing

1248
00:51:14,180 --> 00:51:12,150
and it's human induced well if you

1249
00:51:15,950 --> 00:51:14,190
just lay that out and put it before

1250
00:51:18,410 --> 00:51:15,960
people so they can make up their own

1251
00:51:20,870 --> 00:51:18,420
minds I think that's the best we can do

1252
00:51:21,829 --> 00:51:20,880
and then that problem comes because

1253
00:51:23,569 --> 00:51:21,839
you've got to figure out what to do

1254
00:51:25,700 --> 00:51:23,579
about it that removes into the realm of

1255
00:51:27,140 --> 00:51:25,710
political science which because it's got

1256
00:51:30,650 --> 00:51:27,150
science at the end of it means it's not

1257
00:51:33,740 --> 00:51:30,660
yeah yeah well you know I think that we

1258
00:51:36,349 --> 00:51:33,750
need to appreciate your like biggest

1259
00:51:39,019 --> 00:51:36,359
pushing them in my job it's not so much

1260
00:51:40,910 --> 00:51:39,029
to raise science literacy not I don't

1261
00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:40,920
want to make everyone an Einstein in

1262
00:51:46,130 --> 00:51:43,170
this country but i do want everyone to

1263
00:51:49,279 --> 00:51:46,140
respect science science has got a lot to

1264
00:51:52,010 --> 00:51:49,289
offer we know that science is a special

1265
00:51:54,500 --> 00:51:52,020
quality of information and we want to

1266
00:51:56,900 --> 00:51:54,510
get that respect back for it and i use

1267
00:51:58,339 --> 00:51:56,910
the analogy you know in this country you

1268
00:52:01,250 --> 00:51:58,349
only succeed if you've got a sporting

1269
00:52:03,079 --> 00:52:01,260
analogy now let's face it there are a

1270
00:52:05,450 --> 00:52:03,089
lot of people out there who barrack for

1271
00:52:07,220 --> 00:52:05,460
football teams who would never bother

1272
00:52:10,190 --> 00:52:07,230
actually pulling on the boots and play

1273
00:52:11,720 --> 00:52:10,200
football if they respect the game yeah

1274
00:52:13,549 --> 00:52:11,730
and that's all we're asking about

1275
00:52:16,130 --> 00:52:13,559
science we're not asking people to

1276
00:52:17,839 --> 00:52:16,140
become you know did you say we lost is

1277
00:52:19,609 --> 00:52:17,849
it some stage you think it was greater

1278
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:19,619
in the past and it lasted at some

1279
00:52:23,569 --> 00:52:21,450
staging we ever had it I already don't

1280
00:52:25,640 --> 00:52:23,579
think we ever had it but how do we get

1281
00:52:28,549 --> 00:52:25,650
that sounds respect out there and I

1282
00:52:29,779 --> 00:52:28,559
think it's simply by let's just let's

1283
00:52:32,059 --> 00:52:29,789
just show you some of the clever stuff

1284
00:52:33,769 --> 00:52:32,069
they don't let me show you some of the

1285
00:52:35,359 --> 00:52:33,779
impressive plays that the teams are

1286
00:52:37,700 --> 00:52:35,369
putting out there on the field now what

1287
00:52:38,779 --> 00:52:37,710
is the scientific breakthrough recently

1288
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:38,789
that's blown your mind a bit of

1289
00:52:41,750 --> 00:52:40,170
information that's come through your new

1290
00:52:43,339 --> 00:52:41,760
show where you've gone well Fisk me I

1291
00:52:47,599 --> 00:52:43,349
can't believe that well the one that the

1292
00:52:52,010 --> 00:52:47,609
one that I love because my area is

1293
00:52:54,620 --> 00:52:52,020
paleontology just last week we found a

1294
00:52:55,700 --> 00:52:54,630
dinosaur bird one of these these I

1295
00:52:57,710 --> 00:52:55,710
thought you go you're gonna go the

1296
00:52:59,539 --> 00:52:57,720
mammoth that they actually bled the

1297
00:53:01,970 --> 00:52:59,549
blood as now you can carbon-date that

1298
00:53:05,390 --> 00:53:01,980
that's not even a bloody fossil and but

1299
00:53:07,779 --> 00:53:05,400
but but the thing is is that what's so

1300
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:07,789
cute about this it's a called or honest

1301
00:53:14,870 --> 00:53:12,450
and it comes from China is that you get

1302
00:53:17,359 --> 00:53:14,880
those dunderheads in creationism that

1303
00:53:18,470 --> 00:53:17,369
are saying well evolution can't be a

1304
00:53:20,599 --> 00:53:18,480
science because you can't make

1305
00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:20,609
predictions and that's complete

1306
00:53:24,930 --> 00:53:22,810
because we predicted this bird would be

1307
00:53:26,850 --> 00:53:24,940
we predicted what it would be like we

1308
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:26,860
predicted how old it would be we

1309
00:53:31,350 --> 00:53:29,530
predicted features of its skeleton down

1310
00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:31,360
to the nth degree what would be that and

1311
00:53:35,700 --> 00:53:33,130
guess what we found that it was all

1312
00:53:39,810 --> 00:53:35,710
there it turned up so you know it just

1313
00:53:42,060 --> 00:53:39,820
to me was so sweet that in one beautiful

1314
00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:42,070
fossil specimen we were able to show

1315
00:53:48,690 --> 00:53:45,610
yeah evolution evolutionary biology it

1316
00:53:50,550 --> 00:53:48,700
is a science you do make predictions you

1317
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:50,560
can go out and confirm those predictions

1318
00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:53,290
you can back your theories up just like

1319
00:53:56,550 --> 00:53:55,330
any other science in the world of whoo

1320
00:53:58,350 --> 00:53:56,560
and I've asked a lot of people this have

1321
00:54:00,450 --> 00:53:58,360
even asked James around e if there was

1322
00:54:02,790 --> 00:54:00,460
one woo one shooter science one

1323
00:54:04,740 --> 00:54:02,800
conspiracy theory one thing that was

1324
00:54:06,090 --> 00:54:04,750
real is it when you wish was real as

1325
00:54:09,300 --> 00:54:06,100
they want gee that'd be good if that was

1326
00:54:11,820 --> 00:54:09,310
real I would like the Midas touch whoa

1327
00:54:14,220 --> 00:54:11,830
you know that would be that would be the

1328
00:54:15,690 --> 00:54:14,230
one heart one you know even figuratively

1329
00:54:17,490 --> 00:54:15,700
to be able to walk into a bar and know

1330
00:54:18,720 --> 00:54:17,500
that seventy-five percent of what you

1331
00:54:21,690 --> 00:54:18,730
say was going to be correct would be

1332
00:54:23,250 --> 00:54:21,700
great wouldn't it yo man I want that you

1333
00:54:25,770 --> 00:54:23,260
know everything you touch turns to gold

1334
00:54:27,360 --> 00:54:25,780
you know because that it would make

1335
00:54:29,550 --> 00:54:27,370
going to the toilet somewhat of an

1336
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:29,560
experienced anything to do with that but

1337
00:54:34,560 --> 00:54:32,170
but you know I mean the idea that you

1338
00:54:35,790 --> 00:54:34,570
could just okay own picture money all

1339
00:54:37,860 --> 00:54:35,800
right I'll just touch this app awake

1340
00:54:40,860 --> 00:54:37,870
golden apple anyone would buy an apple

1341
00:54:42,300 --> 00:54:40,870
made of gold DNE ok maybe you just need

1342
00:54:44,820 --> 00:54:42,310
something maybe need to any bit lower

1343
00:54:48,060 --> 00:54:44,830
maybe the ATM touches all you need the

1344
00:54:49,710 --> 00:54:48,070
ATM and to retro go be more than two

1345
00:54:51,060 --> 00:54:49,720
retro huh well thanks for joining us

1346
00:54:52,830 --> 00:54:51,070
here tonight and having a lot of fun and

1347
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:52,840
please everyone come along the first

1348
00:54:57,660 --> 00:54:54,970
thursday next month it's upstairs at the

1349
00:54:59,520 --> 00:54:57,670
the coronation hotel in the mezz bar it

1350
00:55:00,840 --> 00:54:59,530
is and it's been great to have you have

1351
00:55:02,700 --> 00:55:00,850
a great journey back to south australia

1352
00:55:04,770 --> 00:55:02,710
house how is Adelaide rocking at the

1353
00:55:07,680 --> 00:55:04,780
moment I had some of the best sex of my

1354
00:55:09,810 --> 00:55:07,690
life in North Adelaide north adelaide is

1355
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:09,820
just a wild spot is it still the same is

1356
00:55:13,800 --> 00:55:11,290
that chip shop where the guy says g'day

1357
00:55:16,320 --> 00:55:13,810
boss still there Adelaide is a fantastic

1358
00:55:18,120 --> 00:55:16,330
place to be I love it there and they all

1359
00:55:20,760 --> 00:55:18,130
you need to know about Adelaide is that

1360
00:55:22,080 --> 00:55:20,770
within an hour of my front door a 300 of

1361
00:55:23,460 --> 00:55:22,090
the best seller doors on the planet

1362
00:55:24,990 --> 00:55:23,470
that's right and and of course your

1363
00:55:26,940 --> 00:55:25,000
irregular that maslin's I believe

1364
00:55:29,460 --> 00:55:26,950
as well ah yeah but that that one

1365
00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:29,470
remains in the vault I'm afraid

1366
00:55:35,190 --> 00:55:32,410
right the to come back soon will do look

1367
00:55:38,130 --> 00:55:35,200
we hear it skeptics at the pub tonight

1368
00:55:39,930 --> 00:55:38,140
I'm trying out a new haircut I was going

1369
00:55:41,880 --> 00:55:39,940
for the car mcglaughlin haircut but it's

1370
00:55:43,080 --> 00:55:41,890
gone horribly wrong I think we're going

1371
00:55:45,690 --> 00:55:43,090
to be experimenting a lot with my

1372
00:55:48,180 --> 00:55:45,700
haircut but let me tell you here there

1373
00:55:49,589 --> 00:55:48,190
are people hushed as I week the question

1374
00:55:51,540 --> 00:55:49,599
for the evening which has been put to us

1375
00:55:53,099 --> 00:55:51,550
by Sir Paul Willis he was knighted

1376
00:55:54,359 --> 00:55:53,109
briefly during the evening I don't know

1377
00:55:57,660 --> 00:55:54,369
if it's official but I'm going to go

1378
00:55:59,849 --> 00:55:57,670
with it when is enough enough in the

1379
00:56:01,410 --> 00:55:59,859
skeptic trade when should we call it a

1380
00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:01,420
day over something or actually Richard

1381
00:56:05,070 --> 00:56:02,770
how would you put it you is it when

1382
00:56:06,780 --> 00:56:05,080
should we stop pursuing anti-vaccination

1383
00:56:09,150 --> 00:56:06,790
people and that sort of thing when

1384
00:56:11,250 --> 00:56:09,160
should we stop water divining and what

1385
00:56:12,720 --> 00:56:11,260
is the stopping point where okay that

1386
00:56:13,859 --> 00:56:12,730
one's done we'll move on is that what

1387
00:56:16,560 --> 00:56:13,869
you want me to ask yeah it's a good

1388
00:56:18,810 --> 00:56:16,570
question because it's like we don't

1389
00:56:21,060 --> 00:56:18,820
chase pixies and fairies because

1390
00:56:23,250 --> 00:56:21,070
everybody knows that's that's mythology

1391
00:56:26,460 --> 00:56:23,260
so when it comes to something like water

1392
00:56:29,040 --> 00:56:26,470
divining or yeah even the and Eve axes

1393
00:56:31,800 --> 00:56:29,050
when do we say not it's been dealt with

1394
00:56:34,109 --> 00:56:31,810
that's enough I don't think there's a

1395
00:56:36,180 --> 00:56:34,119
good answer to that question yeah look I

1396
00:56:37,740 --> 00:56:36,190
think a lot of people pretty those with

1397
00:56:39,690 --> 00:56:37,750
children will say as long as children

1398
00:56:41,609 --> 00:56:39,700
our risk and it runs definition of why

1399
00:56:43,440 --> 00:56:41,619
how the children may be at risk could be

1400
00:56:45,030 --> 00:56:43,450
any false information being out there

1401
00:56:46,500 --> 00:56:45,040
whatsoever that could be some people so

1402
00:56:49,470 --> 00:56:46,510
and some people's mind the battle would

1403
00:56:51,720 --> 00:56:49,480
never be over yeah that's true now

1404
00:56:53,490 --> 00:56:51,730
anti-vaxxers and water divining a pretty

1405
00:56:55,710 --> 00:56:53,500
different very different very very

1406
00:56:56,880 --> 00:56:55,720
different things but would there are

1407
00:56:58,440 --> 00:56:56,890
still lots of people out there who

1408
00:57:00,329 --> 00:56:58,450
claimed more than the vinings real now

1409
00:57:05,570 --> 00:57:00,339
you can say the h'harn about that is not

1410
00:57:10,160 --> 00:57:05,580
so great one day I think it's like the

1411
00:57:11,630 --> 00:57:10,170
years ago the smoking question see some

1412
00:57:13,460 --> 00:57:11,640
people are skeptical they reckon that

1413
00:57:15,320 --> 00:57:13,470
smoking causes harm how are those silly

1414
00:57:17,990 --> 00:57:15,330
people well now we all accept that

1415
00:57:19,550 --> 00:57:18,000
smoking causes harm oh yeah but you

1416
00:57:21,530 --> 00:57:19,560
still haven't owned up to the great

1417
00:57:23,960 --> 00:57:21,540
fluoride conspiracy at Richard you are

1418
00:57:25,910 --> 00:57:23,970
still putting that bat sting from the

1419
00:57:29,210 --> 00:57:25,920
periodic table into the water we are

1420
00:57:31,340 --> 00:57:29,220
with glee we may not I like your haircut

1421
00:57:33,170 --> 00:57:31,350
by the way I thank you it should be

1422
00:57:34,580 --> 00:57:33,180
fairly controversial but it probably

1423
00:57:36,500 --> 00:57:34,590
won't be now I see that mikhay is

1424
00:57:38,090 --> 00:57:36,510
actually voted to have the fluoride back

1425
00:57:40,190 --> 00:57:38,100
in their water actually oh and some

1426
00:57:41,480 --> 00:57:40,200
breaking news I have noticed say i read

1427
00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:41,490
that today it's going back in the water

1428
00:57:46,700 --> 00:57:45,450
today a win a win for us all exactly how

1429
00:57:48,740 --> 00:57:46,710
and why it's going back in but it's

1430
00:57:50,420 --> 00:57:48,750
going back in all right yeah well I'm

1431
00:57:52,850 --> 00:57:50,430
good for them but getting back to the

1432
00:57:55,040 --> 00:57:52,860
question like a ghost and what stays to

1433
00:57:56,360 --> 00:57:55,050
the skeptics eight you look come on you

1434
00:57:59,180 --> 00:57:56,370
know we've we've been there we've

1435
00:58:01,400 --> 00:57:59,190
investigated I guess as long as people

1436
00:58:02,540 --> 00:58:01,410
are still making the claim okay how

1437
00:58:03,980 --> 00:58:02,550
about I asked a few people and see what

1438
00:58:05,870 --> 00:58:03,990
they think here tonight let's do it and

1439
00:58:07,820 --> 00:58:05,880
don't forget it's a first thursday of

1440
00:58:09,620 --> 00:58:07,830
every month upstairs at the coronation

1441
00:58:11,180 --> 00:58:09,630
hotel and it's it's pretty packed and

1442
00:58:13,340 --> 00:58:11,190
i'm at about 80 people here tonight it's

1443
00:58:15,260 --> 00:58:13,350
good start we'll go straight to the man

1444
00:58:17,750 --> 00:58:15,270
who had the longest question i've heard

1445
00:58:20,240 --> 00:58:17,760
out of skeptical we got here Oh Gary

1446
00:58:21,770 --> 00:58:20,250
Gary Dalrymple now you asked a question

1447
00:58:24,200 --> 00:58:21,780
about our our spokesman about

1448
00:58:26,210 --> 00:58:24,210
conspiracies tonight but what do the

1449
00:58:28,070 --> 00:58:26,220
question were asking is when is enough

1450
00:58:30,020 --> 00:58:28,080
enough with the skeptics movement on

1451
00:58:32,300 --> 00:58:30,030
certain issues such as water divining

1452
00:58:34,040 --> 00:58:32,310
even anti-vaccination when should you

1453
00:58:35,570 --> 00:58:34,050
care okay with one we should move on to

1454
00:58:37,010 --> 00:58:35,580
something else do you what point should

1455
00:58:39,569 --> 00:58:37,020
that be

1456
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:39,579
probably when the last Daily Telegraph

1457
00:58:44,220 --> 00:58:41,410
journalist chokes on their own is

1458
00:58:46,380 --> 00:58:44,230
hanging by their own entrails and the

1459
00:58:48,900 --> 00:58:46,390
last conspiracy website sort of self

1460
00:58:51,120 --> 00:58:48,910
implodes what going to be out for quite

1461
00:58:54,660 --> 00:58:51,130
a while then well there is a tremendous

1462
00:58:55,740 --> 00:58:54,670
Gulf of credibility to be traversed look

1463
00:58:58,650 --> 00:58:55,750
actually the question we're asking

1464
00:59:00,660 --> 00:58:58,660
people tonight jovi knew his um when is

1465
00:59:02,430 --> 00:59:00,670
enough enough when should skeptic stop

1466
00:59:03,720 --> 00:59:02,440
on a certain topic and move to another

1467
00:59:04,980 --> 00:59:03,730
one how do you know when enough is

1468
00:59:07,020 --> 00:59:04,990
enough and you've gone to one the issue

1469
00:59:10,220 --> 00:59:07,030
and it's time to stop such as water

1470
00:59:12,809 --> 00:59:10,230
divining even anti-vaccination anything

1471
00:59:15,210 --> 00:59:12,819
well I mean I think we've kind of

1472
00:59:16,470 --> 00:59:15,220
established that these are all you know

1473
00:59:19,500 --> 00:59:16,480
as we like to say they're unsinkable

1474
00:59:22,530 --> 00:59:19,510
rubber ducks so I don't think we can

1475
00:59:24,750 --> 00:59:22,540
ever stop because they keep coming up

1476
00:59:27,109 --> 00:59:24,760
over and over again so i don't know

1477
00:59:30,960 --> 00:59:27,119
maybe maybe we need to focus less on the

1478
00:59:33,900 --> 00:59:30,970
specific topics and more on helping

1479
00:59:37,500 --> 00:59:33,910
people develop the skills broadly to

1480
00:59:39,359 --> 00:59:37,510
recognize the floors rather than taking

1481
00:59:41,010 --> 00:59:39,369
on each individual thing but at the same

1482
00:59:42,809 --> 00:59:41,020
time there's enough of us that are

1483
00:59:44,700 --> 00:59:42,819
experts in all these other areas that if

1484
00:59:47,609 --> 00:59:44,710
we could push the expert expert in that

1485
00:59:49,819 --> 00:59:47,619
direction and rather than kind of all

1486
00:59:51,690 --> 00:59:49,829
feeling we have to focus on one thing

1487
00:59:53,130 --> 00:59:51,700
that could be one way of getting around

1488
00:59:54,750 --> 00:59:53,140
it but i think it's time we moved on to

1489
00:59:56,370 --> 00:59:54,760
hologram theory how many times do i have

1490
00:59:57,960 --> 00:59:56,380
to tell you I'm big on this we're all

1491
00:59:59,970 --> 00:59:57,970
three dimensional projections of a

1492
01:00:02,339 --> 00:59:59,980
two-dimensional projection object that

1493
01:00:03,599 --> 01:00:02,349
we can't see that's what we are when are

1494
01:00:05,700 --> 01:00:03,609
we going to move on to that nate is

1495
01:00:07,200 --> 01:00:05,710
blowing my mind look the physics

1496
01:00:09,390 --> 01:00:07,210
supported I saw it on her eyes on one

1497
01:00:10,770 --> 01:00:09,400
night at nine o'clock can I go back to

1498
01:00:12,839 --> 01:00:10,780
your original question I think you

1499
01:00:15,059 --> 01:00:12,849
better first of all absolutely hologram

1500
01:00:19,079 --> 01:00:15,069
theory I completely support it

1501
01:00:22,199 --> 01:00:19,089
I have evidence to support it in my

1502
01:00:25,229 --> 01:00:22,209
fridge now the question to the question

1503
01:00:27,569 --> 01:00:25,239
about whether when we should stop well

1504
01:00:29,219 --> 01:00:27,579
I'd say I've taken away from what Joe

1505
01:00:31,019 --> 01:00:29,229
said about in principle when should the

1506
01:00:32,489 --> 01:00:31,029
skeptics it in general stop and I'll say

1507
01:00:34,859 --> 01:00:32,499
when when you stop on a personal level

1508
01:00:37,229 --> 01:00:34,869
so on a personal level when you stop

1509
01:00:38,969 --> 01:00:37,239
having fun okay so when you speak to

1510
01:00:42,120 --> 01:00:38,979
somebody and he just gets a bit boring

1511
01:00:44,219 --> 01:00:42,130
and tedious that's definitely when you

1512
01:00:46,140 --> 01:00:44,229
should stop and alternative reason to

1513
01:00:47,999 --> 01:00:46,150
stop is when you realize that you

1514
01:00:49,620 --> 01:00:48,009
speaking to a true believer meaning

1515
01:00:51,689 --> 01:00:49,630
you're never gonna get you going to

1516
01:00:53,370 --> 01:00:51,699
convince that person and nobody else is

1517
01:00:57,109 --> 01:00:53,380
listening so there's no real audience

1518
01:00:59,219 --> 01:00:57,119
for that's a good time to say gotta go

1519
01:01:00,809 --> 01:00:59,229
which is why which is why when you're

1520
01:01:03,089 --> 01:01:00,819
when you're dealing with stuff online in

1521
01:01:04,559 --> 01:01:03,099
a public forum you might have the true

1522
01:01:05,789 --> 01:01:04,569
believer on the other end who's never

1523
01:01:07,229 --> 01:01:05,799
going to listen to you but you've got to

1524
01:01:08,699 --> 01:01:07,239
remember how do you know when to get off

1525
01:01:11,130 --> 01:01:08,709
the forum how do you know when to leave

1526
01:01:13,380 --> 01:01:11,140
it look I just I just think it gets to a

1527
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:13,390
point where if you're copping a lot of

1528
01:01:18,749 --> 01:01:16,690
abuse and you really are not getting it

1529
01:01:20,699 --> 01:01:18,759
I think I think in a forum for example

1530
01:01:22,380 --> 01:01:20,709
if there's no one who's asking you a

1531
01:01:24,089 --> 01:01:22,390
question that suggests that they're

1532
01:01:26,370 --> 01:01:24,099
willing to listen or that they're

1533
01:01:27,870 --> 01:01:26,380
interested or sort of saying well hang

1534
01:01:29,489 --> 01:01:27,880
on a second I hadn't considered that or

1535
01:01:31,829 --> 01:01:29,499
something like that then maybe it's time

1536
01:01:34,079 --> 01:01:31,839
to just kind of walk away and take it

1537
01:01:35,819 --> 01:01:34,089
off at another time well it also around

1538
01:01:37,380 --> 01:01:35,829
the table here we've got the editor of

1539
01:01:39,120 --> 01:01:37,390
the skeptic magazine how are you I

1540
01:01:40,709 --> 01:01:39,130
really well thank you moment and what's

1541
01:01:42,359 --> 01:01:40,719
coming up the next issue by the way I

1542
01:01:44,099 --> 01:01:42,369
think of a lot of stuff about conspiracy

1543
01:01:45,989 --> 01:01:44,109
theories actually all right now what's

1544
01:01:49,890 --> 01:01:45,999
your favorite I favorite conspiracy yeah

1545
01:01:52,319 --> 01:01:49,900
yeah my big conspiracy was I once

1546
01:01:54,089 --> 01:01:52,329
actually went to Loch Ness oh you loved

1547
01:01:56,239 --> 01:01:54,099
it I loved Loch Ness and by side of the

1548
01:01:58,620 --> 01:01:56,249
road there was a one of those mobile

1549
01:02:00,870 --> 01:01:58,630
food stores take away food stores they

1550
01:02:03,299 --> 01:02:00,880
have in the UK all the time and this one

1551
01:02:05,189 --> 01:02:03,309
was for selling monster burgers so

1552
01:02:06,520 --> 01:02:05,199
that's my conspiracy they use fee

1553
01:02:08,500 --> 01:02:06,530
monsters in

1554
01:02:10,690 --> 01:02:08,510
more than any more they sold them oh sad

1555
01:02:12,610 --> 01:02:10,700
actually and when you think enough is

1556
01:02:14,590 --> 01:02:12,620
enough in the skeptical world as far as

1557
01:02:16,150 --> 01:02:14,600
arguing with someone and also an issue

1558
01:02:18,070 --> 01:02:16,160
like when should you drop an issue cos

1559
01:02:20,710 --> 01:02:18,080
the Australian skeptics a bit doing like

1560
01:02:22,660 --> 01:02:20,720
water diviners for years now so you know

1561
01:02:23,560 --> 01:02:22,670
is that time to give it a while though

1562
01:02:25,810 --> 01:02:23,570
there's still plenty of people to

1563
01:02:27,400 --> 01:02:25,820
believe in it actually the vast majority

1564
01:02:28,810 --> 01:02:27,410
of people who go for the challenge

1565
01:02:30,760 --> 01:02:28,820
hundred thousand little challenge our

1566
01:02:32,080 --> 01:02:30,770
water diviners I think everyone agrees

1567
01:02:33,520 --> 01:02:32,090
they're virtually all the waters of

1568
01:02:36,010 --> 01:02:33,530
Anna's we see a pretty genuine people

1569
01:02:38,440 --> 01:02:36,020
they really believe they can do it if we

1570
01:02:41,200 --> 01:02:38,450
don't say they're not xiang's well they

1571
01:02:43,420 --> 01:02:41,210
don't believe they shanks ya see the

1572
01:02:45,520 --> 01:02:43,430
other thing is set up ya know personally

1573
01:02:47,530 --> 01:02:45,530
you find yourself occasionally when you

1574
01:02:49,480 --> 01:02:47,540
find yourself sort of mouthing the same

1575
01:02:50,740 --> 01:02:49,490
stuff you've said a lot of times it's

1576
01:02:52,090 --> 01:02:50,750
like it's trying to pull out and then

1577
01:02:54,250 --> 01:02:52,100
for a while I did that actually was a

1578
01:02:56,530 --> 01:02:54,260
cadet reason you got to refresh yourself

1579
01:02:58,600 --> 01:02:56,540
and and yeah reinvigorate your self and

1580
01:02:59,950 --> 01:02:58,610
re involved yourself when you're talking

1581
01:03:04,720 --> 01:02:59,960
to someone else who just is not

1582
01:03:08,410 --> 01:03:04,730
listening my cannon see now is to go

1583
01:03:10,240 --> 01:03:08,420
quiet and then hip coming I was seeing

1584
01:03:12,190 --> 01:03:10,250
that works and I've won that way you see

1585
01:03:15,700 --> 01:03:12,200
if I invite if I if I knock them out i

1586
01:03:18,220 --> 01:03:15,710
won the argument well there it was

1587
01:03:20,290 --> 01:03:18,230
another skeptics in the pub as we said

1588
01:03:22,030 --> 01:03:20,300
at the coronation hotel upstairs at the

1589
01:03:24,520 --> 01:03:22,040
mezz bar and the next one is going to be

1590
01:03:26,140 --> 01:03:24,530
on Thursday the fourth of July come

1591
01:03:27,550 --> 01:03:26,150
along and we'll see you then and by the

1592
01:03:31,030 --> 01:03:27,560
way if you want to know what we got up

1593
01:03:32,650 --> 01:03:31,040
to at tam 2012 the very last of the

1594
01:03:35,080 --> 01:03:32,660
interviews that I did there for that and

1595
01:03:38,860 --> 01:03:35,090
now on my own podcast go to Maynard

1596
01:03:42,820 --> 01:03:38,870
Maynard com au and on the front page

1597
01:03:44,350 --> 01:03:42,830
you'll see the music of jam 2012 part 2

1598
01:03:46,030 --> 01:03:44,360
there's some wild tunes in there there's

1599
01:03:48,670 --> 01:03:46,040
a little bit of mr. Richard Saunders a

1600
01:03:50,560 --> 01:03:48,680
few surprises in there and lindley the

1601
01:03:52,690 --> 01:03:50,570
postie requesting some devo it's all

1602
01:03:54,250 --> 01:03:52,700
there my not calm that I you I'm going

1603
01:03:56,910 --> 01:03:54,260
to go downstairs now and see if I can

1604
01:04:00,580 --> 01:03:56,920
just mingle with the conspiracy theory

1605
01:04:25,790 --> 01:04:00,590
you know Oswald was set up Oswald was a

1606
01:04:31,710 --> 01:04:28,410
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1607
01:04:34,410 --> 01:04:31,720
zone and I hope I certainly hope I get

1608
01:04:37,770 --> 01:04:34,420
to meet you at the amazing meeting in

1609
01:04:40,050 --> 01:04:37,780
Las Vegas free Pegasus folding lessons

1610
01:04:42,780 --> 01:04:40,060
what more could you ask for well quite

1611
01:04:44,730 --> 01:04:42,790
frankly a lot I guess I'm also happy to

1612
01:04:46,680 --> 01:04:44,740
say that our good friend Joanne Bellamy

1613
01:04:48,450 --> 01:04:46,690
will be hit the amazing meeting and

1614
01:04:50,430 --> 01:04:48,460
posting Lindley from Melbourne and

1615
01:04:52,170 --> 01:04:50,440
demanded valve from Canberra and lots of

1616
01:04:55,770 --> 01:04:52,180
other Australians will be at the amazing

1617
01:05:00,300 --> 01:04:55,780
meeting with no doubt lots of Minty's

1618
01:05:01,710 --> 01:05:00,310
and tim tams and must excite a must

1619
01:05:04,440 --> 01:05:01,720
stick before and you come to the amazing

1620
01:05:08,070 --> 01:05:04,450
meeting see if you can find me say

1621
01:05:11,250 --> 01:05:08,080
Richard I want my mustika and we'll take

1622
01:05:12,810 --> 01:05:11,260
it from there hmm Australians will know

1623
01:05:15,090 --> 01:05:12,820
what I mean thank you to all those

1624
01:05:17,070 --> 01:05:15,100
people who contribute only a dollar a

1625
01:05:19,080 --> 01:05:17,080
week some very generous people

1626
01:05:23,130 --> 01:05:19,090
contribute a bit more but a dollar a

1627
01:05:25,500 --> 01:05:23,140
week helps a lot ah by visiting WWE pegs

1628
01:05:28,200 --> 01:05:25,510
on TV and you can chip in to the

1629
01:05:30,750 --> 01:05:28,210
skeptics earn it helps us keep the show

1630
01:05:34,440 --> 01:05:30,760
going and thank you to all those people

1631
01:05:35,820 --> 01:05:34,450
who visit w WC optics com today you to

1632
01:05:38,400 --> 01:05:35,830
find out more about the Australian

1633
01:05:42,990 --> 01:05:38,410
skeptics and subscribe online to our

1634
01:05:46,020 --> 01:05:43,000
wonderful magazine the skeptic is a an

1635
01:05:48,780 --> 01:05:46,030
imaginative name for you but for this

1636
01:05:54,720 --> 01:05:48,790
week this is Richard Saunders signing

1637
01:05:57,060 --> 01:05:54,730
off from Sydney Australia you've been

1638
01:06:01,980 --> 01:05:57,070
listening to the skeptic zone

1639
01:06:05,010 --> 01:06:01,990
visit our website at www skeptics on TV